1 00:00:15,161 --> 00:00:17,601 - I'm going to work in Woolworths. 2 00:00:17,601 --> 00:00:20,321 - When I grow up, I want to be an astronaut. 3 00:00:20,321 --> 00:00:22,921 - When I get married, I'd like to have two children. 4 00:00:22,921 --> 00:00:26,561 - My heart's desire is to see my daddy. 5 00:00:26,561 --> 00:00:29,481 - I don't want to answer that. 6 00:00:31,961 --> 00:00:34,681 - This is no ordinary outing to the zoo. 7 00:00:34,681 --> 00:00:36,521 It's a very special occasion. 8 00:00:36,521 --> 00:00:38,241 We've brought these children together 9 00:00:38,241 --> 00:00:39,761 for the very first time. 10 00:00:41,601 --> 00:00:44,241 They're like any other children except that they come 11 00:00:44,241 --> 00:00:46,641 from startlingly different backgrounds. 12 00:00:47,721 --> 00:00:49,321 - Stop it at once! 13 00:00:49,321 --> 00:00:50,881 - We've brought these children together 14 00:00:50,881 --> 00:00:55,881 because we wanted a glimpse of England in the year 2000. 15 00:00:55,921 --> 00:00:59,041 The shop steward and the executive of the year 2000 16 00:00:59,041 --> 00:01:00,521 are now seven years old. 17 00:01:04,921 --> 00:01:09,161 - In 1964, "World in Action" made "Seven Up!" 18 00:01:09,161 --> 00:01:11,201 and we've been back to film these children 19 00:01:11,201 --> 00:01:12,521 every seven years. 20 00:01:14,721 --> 00:01:16,121 They are now 49. 21 00:01:21,361 --> 00:01:24,041 - Is it important to fight, yes. 22 00:01:26,081 --> 00:01:28,921 - Tony was brought up in the East End of London. 23 00:01:30,801 --> 00:01:31,961 - Wanna be a jockey when I grow up. 24 00:01:31,961 --> 00:01:35,361 Yeah, I wanna be a jockey when I grow up. 25 00:01:38,321 --> 00:01:40,961 - At 14, he was already an apprentice 26 00:01:40,961 --> 00:01:44,001 at Tommy Gosling's racing stable at Epsom. 27 00:01:44,001 --> 00:01:46,161 At 15, he'd left school. 28 00:01:51,481 --> 00:01:54,801 - This is a photo finish, when I rode at Newbury. 29 00:01:54,801 --> 00:01:56,241 I'm the one with the white cap. 30 00:01:56,241 --> 00:01:58,321 I was beaten a length and a half off third 31 00:01:58,321 --> 00:01:59,721 and I had a photo finish. 32 00:02:00,801 --> 00:02:02,961 - Do you regret not making it? 33 00:02:02,961 --> 00:02:04,561 - Well I'd have given my right arm 34 00:02:04,561 --> 00:02:07,361 at the time to become a jockey but now, 35 00:02:08,361 --> 00:02:10,441 well, I wasn't good enough. 36 00:02:10,441 --> 00:02:11,281 - What will you do 37 00:02:11,281 --> 00:02:13,521 if you don't make it as a jockey? 38 00:02:13,521 --> 00:02:14,921 - I don't know. 39 00:02:14,921 --> 00:02:19,241 If I know I couldn't be one, I'd get out of the game. 40 00:02:19,241 --> 00:02:20,841 Wouldn't bother. 41 00:02:20,841 --> 00:02:23,521 - What do you think you would do then? 42 00:02:23,521 --> 00:02:24,801 - Learn on taxis. 43 00:02:27,201 --> 00:02:29,521 - At 21, he was on the knowledge 44 00:02:29,521 --> 00:02:32,321 and by 28, he owned his own cab. 45 00:02:33,321 --> 00:02:36,281 - It's surprising who you pick up, you see. 46 00:02:36,281 --> 00:02:39,401 I once met Kojak, I picked him up. 47 00:02:39,401 --> 00:02:42,761 And Warren Mitchell, Alf Garnett, you know. 48 00:02:42,761 --> 00:02:44,041 - Have you got a girlfriend? 49 00:02:44,041 --> 00:02:45,121 - No. 50 00:02:45,121 --> 00:02:47,601 - Would you like to have a girlfriend? 51 00:02:47,601 --> 00:02:48,801 - No. 52 00:02:48,801 --> 00:02:50,721 You understand four Fs? 53 00:02:50,721 --> 00:02:52,881 Find 'em, feed 'em and forget 'em. 54 00:02:52,881 --> 00:02:55,801 The other F, I'll let you use your own discriminish. 55 00:02:55,801 --> 00:03:00,481 I mean, this one, I tried to do the three Fs 56 00:03:00,481 --> 00:03:02,521 but I couldn't forget her. 57 00:03:02,521 --> 00:03:04,401 - I went to a discotheque. 58 00:03:05,361 --> 00:03:07,521 He was in the pub earlier on, 59 00:03:07,521 --> 00:03:09,481 and afterwards, we went to a discotheque 60 00:03:09,481 --> 00:03:11,401 and Tony was standing there. 61 00:03:11,401 --> 00:03:14,081 And I just, from there, I just, 62 00:03:14,081 --> 00:03:14,921 that was it. 63 00:03:17,641 --> 00:03:20,481 Couldn't get rid of him. 64 00:03:21,321 --> 00:03:24,961 - We have our ups and downs, no more than anyone else. 65 00:03:24,961 --> 00:03:28,001 - I think you gotta work at a marriage. 66 00:03:28,001 --> 00:03:31,001 I think all marriages go through stages. 67 00:03:31,001 --> 00:03:32,521 You can't stand each other. 68 00:03:32,521 --> 00:03:34,121 You go through, you know, 69 00:03:34,121 --> 00:03:35,441 I think, oh, god, I hate him. 70 00:03:35,441 --> 00:03:37,281 I wish he'd get out. 71 00:03:37,281 --> 00:03:38,121 I do. 72 00:03:38,121 --> 00:03:39,201 - We've been to the edge of the cliff 73 00:03:39,201 --> 00:03:42,241 and looked over a couple of times, 74 00:03:42,241 --> 00:03:46,121 and we've always seemed to sort of go back, 75 00:03:46,121 --> 00:03:49,081 and we've sort of stayed the course. 76 00:03:49,081 --> 00:03:53,281 But I must say, I mean, it's not easy being married. 77 00:03:53,281 --> 00:03:56,841 - By 42, Tony and Debbie had left the East End 78 00:03:56,841 --> 00:03:58,601 and moved to Woodford in Essex. 79 00:04:00,041 --> 00:04:01,521 - We were gonna put a conservatory here 80 00:04:01,521 --> 00:04:03,921 but if you look along here, 81 00:04:03,921 --> 00:04:07,241 we put a patio in and the pond for the fish, 82 00:04:07,241 --> 00:04:08,601 but the only thing I ever done 83 00:04:08,601 --> 00:04:11,201 was I planted them three trees. 84 00:04:12,401 --> 00:04:13,961 Well, since you was last here, Michael, 85 00:04:13,961 --> 00:04:16,721 we had small trees, if you remember. 86 00:04:16,721 --> 00:04:19,561 Now, they've sort of grown a bit. 87 00:04:20,481 --> 00:04:22,641 - So why are the trees singed? 88 00:04:22,641 --> 00:04:25,481 - We was burning some rubbish at the back 89 00:04:26,321 --> 00:04:28,601 and set light to the tree, and there we all were, 90 00:04:28,601 --> 00:04:31,881 sort of like throwing all buckets of water over it, 91 00:04:31,881 --> 00:04:34,641 and sadly enough, it singed the tree. 92 00:04:49,201 --> 00:04:51,721 - At 49, they've taken out a second mortgage 93 00:04:51,721 --> 00:04:54,161 on the London house and sunk the money 94 00:04:54,161 --> 00:04:55,801 in a holiday home in Spain. 95 00:04:56,761 --> 00:04:57,961 - I'm very pleased with the house. 96 00:04:57,961 --> 00:05:00,561 I said the progress we made in the little space of time 97 00:05:00,561 --> 00:05:02,281 that we've had to work here 98 00:05:02,281 --> 00:05:05,721 and get it all sort of shipshape, I think is done, really, 99 00:05:05,721 --> 00:05:07,481 to the testament of my wife Debbie. 100 00:05:09,241 --> 00:05:10,201 - As per usual. 101 00:05:11,961 --> 00:05:13,801 - Well, Debbie went to the furniture shop, 102 00:05:13,801 --> 00:05:16,641 and she sort of picked all the furniture. 103 00:05:16,641 --> 00:05:19,961 All what you see is all Debbie's choice of furniture 104 00:05:19,961 --> 00:05:21,961 and her, really, sort of style. 105 00:05:23,161 --> 00:05:25,441 The floor, we were led to believe 106 00:05:25,441 --> 00:05:27,481 that we had a choice of tiling, 107 00:05:27,481 --> 00:05:31,241 whether it's a light beige or light brown. 108 00:05:31,241 --> 00:05:33,201 - That's the first I've heard that we had a choice 109 00:05:33,201 --> 00:05:34,801 'cause I would have had plain. 110 00:05:34,801 --> 00:05:36,481 - Well, I've just gone into the neighbours' house 111 00:05:36,481 --> 00:05:37,721 and they've got all plain. 112 00:05:37,721 --> 00:05:38,761 - Well, there you go. 113 00:05:38,761 --> 00:05:39,601 I never got told that. - And I asked him 114 00:05:39,601 --> 00:05:41,641 and he said, "It was a choice that we had 115 00:05:41,641 --> 00:05:44,161 "when we suggested to buy it." 116 00:05:44,161 --> 00:05:45,841 So that was where the mistake was made. 117 00:05:45,841 --> 00:05:47,321 - Because you don't listen. 118 00:05:47,321 --> 00:05:48,161 - Say that again. 119 00:05:48,161 --> 00:05:49,121 - You don't listen. 120 00:05:49,121 --> 00:05:51,801 - Can't hear you. 121 00:05:51,801 --> 00:05:55,401 - Tony and Debbie still work as London cabbies. 122 00:05:55,401 --> 00:05:57,641 - We sold our cabs because we are gonna spend 123 00:05:57,641 --> 00:05:58,521 more time out here. 124 00:05:58,521 --> 00:06:01,081 So it's not really conducive to own a cab, is it? 125 00:06:01,081 --> 00:06:01,921 - No. 126 00:06:01,921 --> 00:06:03,481 - Because the cab will be left out on the drive 127 00:06:03,481 --> 00:06:05,801 or, you know, it's pointless, 128 00:06:05,801 --> 00:06:09,201 so we just hired a cab independently now. 129 00:06:10,081 --> 00:06:14,121 - I'm working harder now than I really ever have done 130 00:06:14,121 --> 00:06:18,481 but I feel that it's for something. 131 00:06:18,481 --> 00:06:19,321 - Tell me, son, 132 00:06:19,321 --> 00:06:21,161 why do you wanna be a cab driver for, mate? 133 00:06:21,161 --> 00:06:22,561 All the holidays in Spain every year 134 00:06:22,561 --> 00:06:24,161 but, son, it's hard work out there. 135 00:06:24,161 --> 00:06:25,161 - You're not reaching me yet. 136 00:06:25,161 --> 00:06:26,001 - Not getting to you. 137 00:06:26,001 --> 00:06:27,201 - No, you're not getting to me, all right? 138 00:06:27,201 --> 00:06:28,241 Now be bigger. 139 00:06:28,241 --> 00:06:29,441 Dominate me, all right? 140 00:06:29,441 --> 00:06:30,281 - Son-- 141 00:06:30,281 --> 00:06:32,921 - At 28, Tony was taking acting lessons. 142 00:06:32,921 --> 00:06:36,601 Now, he supplements his income with occasional TV jobs. 143 00:06:36,601 --> 00:06:37,441 - Oi! 144 00:06:39,561 --> 00:06:40,601 - That's all I got on me. 145 00:06:40,601 --> 00:06:42,681 - Mate, if I had a pound for every time I've heard that, 146 00:06:42,681 --> 00:06:43,761 I'd be a rich man. 147 00:06:43,761 --> 00:06:45,321 Get him! 148 00:06:47,121 --> 00:06:49,961 A guy contacted me from my agency, 149 00:06:49,961 --> 00:06:53,041 from my acting agency, and I got in touch with him. 150 00:06:53,041 --> 00:06:55,521 And he writes plays 151 00:06:55,521 --> 00:06:58,441 and he's been inspired by your up programmes, 152 00:06:58,441 --> 00:07:01,081 which go all round the world, and he saw it. 153 00:07:01,081 --> 00:07:05,881 And we got together and we wrote a biographical play 154 00:07:05,881 --> 00:07:07,081 all about my life story. 155 00:07:08,361 --> 00:07:09,721 We took one of these episodes over to New York 156 00:07:09,721 --> 00:07:12,321 and done it on a play reading. 157 00:07:12,321 --> 00:07:15,681 And I got up, playing the lead role 158 00:07:15,681 --> 00:07:19,001 and it just blew the roof off. 159 00:07:19,001 --> 00:07:20,881 And we're looking for someone to pick it up 160 00:07:20,881 --> 00:07:23,761 and put it on stage. 161 00:07:23,761 --> 00:07:26,001 - Would everybody please sit round now, 162 00:07:26,001 --> 00:07:26,841 get on with their work? 163 00:07:26,841 --> 00:07:29,001 I don't wanna see any backs to me. 164 00:07:29,961 --> 00:07:31,641 Shouldn't be anybody turning round. 165 00:07:31,641 --> 00:07:33,441 Tony, do you hear as well? 166 00:07:35,801 --> 00:07:38,441 Get on with your work at the front. 167 00:07:38,441 --> 00:07:39,241 Tony! 168 00:07:40,721 --> 00:07:42,681 Don't turn round again. 169 00:07:42,681 --> 00:07:45,241 - There's only one ambition, and, really, I want a baby son. 170 00:07:45,241 --> 00:07:48,081 If I see my baby son, that will be my ambition fulfilled. 171 00:07:48,081 --> 00:07:49,081 No one knows that. 172 00:07:49,081 --> 00:07:49,921 Only you know. 173 00:07:51,561 --> 00:07:53,481 - Debbie and Tony have three children. 174 00:07:53,481 --> 00:07:54,321 Nicky. 175 00:07:54,321 --> 00:07:55,121 - Throw it in! 176 00:07:55,121 --> 00:07:57,441 - Jody and Perri. 177 00:07:59,361 --> 00:08:00,721 - Nicky's doing quite well. 178 00:08:00,721 --> 00:08:02,681 He's still a French polisher. 179 00:08:02,681 --> 00:08:04,761 It's an old-time profession, as you know. 180 00:08:04,761 --> 00:08:07,481 And he's working for a firm, 181 00:08:07,481 --> 00:08:09,921 and he's very happy in his work, isn't he? 182 00:08:09,921 --> 00:08:13,801 - He's been brought up very respectful to people, 183 00:08:13,801 --> 00:08:15,481 very well-mannered person, 184 00:08:15,481 --> 00:08:17,681 He's a hard worker. 185 00:08:19,641 --> 00:08:22,281 - Jody, I mean, at this present time, 186 00:08:22,281 --> 00:08:25,761 she's just relies on us a great deal 187 00:08:25,761 --> 00:08:29,921 and she's been very scarred 188 00:08:29,921 --> 00:08:32,561 with a relationship that she was in. 189 00:08:33,801 --> 00:08:36,401 Her relationship with her first love of her own life 190 00:08:36,401 --> 00:08:40,681 was very turbulent, but he's the father of her kid. 191 00:08:43,241 --> 00:08:46,481 We're gonna make sure she gets through it. 192 00:08:46,481 --> 00:08:49,081 And it's been quite a strain on Debbie and I 193 00:08:49,081 --> 00:08:51,401 to see her in that sort of situation. 194 00:08:52,721 --> 00:08:54,961 - I'm very proud of Perri as well. 195 00:08:54,961 --> 00:08:57,641 She got in the post office, and that's what's she doing. 196 00:08:57,641 --> 00:09:00,521 Postman Pel, that's our postman Pel. 197 00:09:00,521 --> 00:09:01,361 She loves it. 198 00:09:01,361 --> 00:09:02,441 She works hard. 199 00:09:02,441 --> 00:09:03,361 She's up at four in the morning. 200 00:09:03,361 --> 00:09:04,881 - In the morning. 201 00:09:04,881 --> 00:09:06,561 She's got a lovely boyfriend. 202 00:09:06,561 --> 00:09:08,561 He loves her more than you can imagine, 203 00:09:08,561 --> 00:09:11,321 and he's certainly got my blessing. 204 00:09:11,321 --> 00:09:14,201 Big lad, very nice guy, loves his football. 205 00:09:14,201 --> 00:09:16,241 You know, typical East End kid. 206 00:09:16,241 --> 00:09:17,081 Here you go. 207 00:09:18,521 --> 00:09:19,361 Aah! 208 00:09:19,361 --> 00:09:20,561 Head up, son. 209 00:09:20,561 --> 00:09:21,401 That's too quick. 210 00:09:21,401 --> 00:09:23,881 We are the backbone for the kids, aren't we? 211 00:09:23,881 --> 00:09:26,561 - Yeah, but I think your parents are anyway, you know. 212 00:09:26,561 --> 00:09:28,481 Your parents are... 213 00:09:28,481 --> 00:09:30,321 You never visualise anything 214 00:09:30,321 --> 00:09:32,161 ever happening to your parents, do you? 215 00:09:32,161 --> 00:09:35,561 You think they are forever. 216 00:09:35,561 --> 00:09:39,641 - Toni's five, Harry's four, nearly five, 217 00:09:39,641 --> 00:09:40,481 and little Pru, 218 00:09:40,481 --> 00:09:42,161 she's nearly two. - Nearly two. 219 00:09:42,161 --> 00:09:43,001 - No, three. 220 00:09:43,001 --> 00:09:44,161 - She's three? 221 00:09:46,001 --> 00:09:47,401 I'm an hands-on granddad. 222 00:09:48,401 --> 00:09:51,241 I love my grandchildren more than you can imagine, 223 00:09:51,241 --> 00:09:54,041 I'd say not my own kids, but in a different way. 224 00:09:54,041 --> 00:09:56,001 It's an obsession of love, you know. 225 00:09:58,561 --> 00:10:02,321 - You see these grandchildren, and they're part of you. 226 00:10:02,321 --> 00:10:03,961 - No, granddad. 227 00:10:03,961 --> 00:10:05,481 Don't empty that. 228 00:10:05,481 --> 00:10:07,441 - They're hard work at times. 229 00:10:07,441 --> 00:10:08,441 - We don't mind, though, Michael, I mean-- 230 00:10:08,441 --> 00:10:10,561 - 'Cause you slow down and you don't realise 231 00:10:10,561 --> 00:10:12,281 you're slowing down. 232 00:10:12,281 --> 00:10:14,401 - All I understand is dogs' prices, 233 00:10:14,401 --> 00:10:17,481 girls, knowledge, roads, streets, squares 234 00:10:17,481 --> 00:10:19,681 and mum and dad and love. 235 00:10:19,681 --> 00:10:22,721 That's all I understand, that's all I wanna understand. 236 00:10:22,721 --> 00:10:24,561 - By the time he was 34, 237 00:10:24,561 --> 00:10:26,441 both Tony's parents had died. 238 00:10:28,361 --> 00:10:29,201 - I'm at the graveside, 239 00:10:29,201 --> 00:10:30,481 I'm talking to her, little things. 240 00:10:30,481 --> 00:10:33,321 I've got all images running through me mind, 241 00:10:33,321 --> 00:10:36,401 sayin' like, "Tony, go downstairs, get me fine weights, 242 00:10:36,401 --> 00:10:38,081 "one and a penny." 243 00:10:38,081 --> 00:10:39,841 And I used to go in the shop. 244 00:10:39,841 --> 00:10:42,481 She used to throw the cotton in an hair curler 245 00:10:42,481 --> 00:10:44,441 over the landing, 246 00:10:44,441 --> 00:10:48,401 and I used to tie the cigarettes on this bit of cotton. 247 00:10:48,401 --> 00:10:50,841 She used to pull 'em up, and she goes, 248 00:10:50,841 --> 00:10:52,121 see her in the end, 249 00:10:52,121 --> 00:10:52,961 "Thanks, Tone. 250 00:10:52,961 --> 00:10:54,961 "See you after school, be good." 251 00:10:54,961 --> 00:10:56,561 And that's the way it was. 252 00:10:57,561 --> 00:11:00,241 - We knew my dad was terminally ill, 253 00:11:00,241 --> 00:11:01,801 although having said that, 254 00:11:01,801 --> 00:11:04,561 still didn't make it any easier for us. 255 00:11:06,041 --> 00:11:08,041 When my dad died, I took it really hard. 256 00:11:10,161 --> 00:11:11,001 I can't. 257 00:11:16,041 --> 00:11:20,041 - Nellie Rose is my mum, 'cause her name is Nell, 258 00:11:20,041 --> 00:11:21,921 and her mother's name's Rose, 259 00:11:21,921 --> 00:11:25,481 so my Jody and all the family 260 00:11:25,481 --> 00:11:28,041 were conjuring up some names that we could name it. 261 00:11:28,041 --> 00:11:30,721 Jody at the finish said, "Nellie Rose", 262 00:11:30,721 --> 00:11:31,921 the name of our mums. 263 00:11:34,401 --> 00:11:37,841 - Sometimes, on a Saturday morning, I go to the pictures, 264 00:11:37,841 --> 00:11:41,761 sometimes with my friends and sometimes with him. 265 00:11:41,761 --> 00:11:42,641 - You don't. 266 00:11:42,641 --> 00:11:43,481 - I do. 267 00:11:44,321 --> 00:11:45,681 - She don't. 268 00:11:45,681 --> 00:11:48,441 - And why did you fall in love with him? 269 00:11:48,441 --> 00:11:49,521 - Don't know. 270 00:11:50,521 --> 00:11:51,361 - I don't know how-- 271 00:11:51,361 --> 00:11:52,201 - Don't know. - You put up with me 272 00:11:52,201 --> 00:11:53,041 for so long. 273 00:11:53,041 --> 00:11:53,881 - I don't know how. 274 00:11:53,881 --> 00:11:55,761 Sometimes, I don't know how I stand him. 275 00:11:55,761 --> 00:11:57,641 Who's to say in another 10 years, 276 00:11:57,641 --> 00:11:59,401 me and him might have split up. 277 00:11:59,401 --> 00:12:01,321 - Quite possible. 278 00:12:01,321 --> 00:12:02,201 - You don't know. 279 00:12:03,441 --> 00:12:06,321 - When we filmed Debbie and Tony at 42, 280 00:12:06,321 --> 00:12:08,161 the marriage seemed to be in trouble. 281 00:12:09,201 --> 00:12:11,641 - I'm not proud at all to say this 282 00:12:11,641 --> 00:12:13,561 but situations arise that 283 00:12:15,121 --> 00:12:20,121 I have had regretful behaviour various times but through-- 284 00:12:21,561 --> 00:12:24,721 - You got caught, and that was it. 285 00:12:24,721 --> 00:12:26,001 - That's, you know. 286 00:12:26,001 --> 00:12:28,161 I'm not lying about the fact. 287 00:12:28,161 --> 00:12:29,681 I mean, you could always cover it up 288 00:12:29,681 --> 00:12:34,481 and suggest other things but it's true and let it be true. 289 00:12:34,481 --> 00:12:35,801 - You caught him? 290 00:12:37,081 --> 00:12:37,961 - Yeah. 291 00:12:37,961 --> 00:12:39,121 - What happened? 292 00:12:40,241 --> 00:12:42,801 - Well, it was touch and go 293 00:12:42,801 --> 00:12:46,521 whether we carried on from it or not. 294 00:12:46,521 --> 00:12:50,281 I did feel I wish things that were said then 295 00:12:50,281 --> 00:12:51,801 was never said. 296 00:12:51,801 --> 00:12:54,961 I mean, Perri wouldn't go to school for three weeks. 297 00:12:54,961 --> 00:12:56,481 She wouldn't go out the door. 298 00:12:56,481 --> 00:12:58,361 She was quite upset about it all 299 00:12:58,361 --> 00:13:01,641 and I think it was a big shock 300 00:13:01,641 --> 00:13:06,001 because you are their mum and dad. 301 00:13:06,001 --> 00:13:08,081 - They're tangerines, ain't they? 302 00:13:08,081 --> 00:13:09,401 We got on from there. 303 00:13:09,401 --> 00:13:11,001 It's sort of seven years down the line, 304 00:13:11,001 --> 00:13:12,921 and we are happy as can be now. 305 00:13:15,201 --> 00:13:16,641 - Karen told me to get me knickers here. 306 00:13:16,641 --> 00:13:19,241 She said they're better than Marks and Spencer's. 307 00:13:20,561 --> 00:13:22,561 - Well, let's hope they're easy to get off. 308 00:13:23,801 --> 00:13:24,641 - Hello! 309 00:13:24,641 --> 00:13:27,241 - There's 96% English here 310 00:13:27,241 --> 00:13:30,321 who bought all their houses in Spain, 311 00:13:30,321 --> 00:13:32,361 and this is where they shop every Saturday. 312 00:13:33,241 --> 00:13:35,041 It's just like an old Petticoat Lane Market, 313 00:13:35,041 --> 00:13:36,561 sort of years ago. 314 00:13:36,561 --> 00:13:38,601 How much are they, darling? 315 00:13:40,681 --> 00:13:42,041 What I like is so relaxing down here, Michael. 316 00:13:42,041 --> 00:13:44,521 You just walk along, and things are happening, 317 00:13:44,521 --> 00:13:46,001 the music's playing. 318 00:13:46,001 --> 00:13:48,561 There's an English pub there you can just go in, 319 00:13:48,561 --> 00:13:51,521 and it's really home from home but with the weather. 320 00:13:55,881 --> 00:13:59,721 From here, it's about 200 yards along. 321 00:13:59,721 --> 00:14:02,241 There's gonna be all commercial units here. 322 00:14:02,241 --> 00:14:05,521 My intentions would be to turn one of these units 323 00:14:05,521 --> 00:14:06,561 into a sports bar. 324 00:14:07,521 --> 00:14:10,401 We're putting all tellies round in a sports sort of way, 325 00:14:10,401 --> 00:14:12,841 football shirts and all that memorabilia. 326 00:14:14,801 --> 00:14:15,961 This is tomorrow for me. 327 00:14:15,961 --> 00:14:18,081 This is my future here. 328 00:14:18,081 --> 00:14:19,641 If I happen to get some sort of business 329 00:14:19,641 --> 00:14:22,481 and I was to bring my Nicky 330 00:14:22,481 --> 00:14:24,761 or bring my Jody and my Perri out here, 331 00:14:25,641 --> 00:14:27,081 then I'll have the best of both worlds. 332 00:14:27,081 --> 00:14:28,481 I'll have my family here, 333 00:14:28,481 --> 00:14:30,161 plus, the kids could be schooled. 334 00:14:31,241 --> 00:14:33,881 Well, they can get what they want, can't they? 335 00:14:33,881 --> 00:14:36,121 If you have got to work for it, 336 00:14:36,121 --> 00:14:38,441 and it's them who can just ask for money and get it, 337 00:14:38,441 --> 00:14:40,561 and they can buy what they want. 338 00:14:40,561 --> 00:14:44,721 I feel that the economy will bust within five years 339 00:14:44,721 --> 00:14:46,321 because people like myself 340 00:14:46,321 --> 00:14:49,201 have been giving and giving all the time. 341 00:14:49,201 --> 00:14:50,961 We're hardworking, family type of people 342 00:14:50,961 --> 00:14:53,041 who have contributed everything 343 00:14:53,041 --> 00:14:54,961 under this Tony Blair's government. 344 00:14:54,961 --> 00:14:57,561 We have to work, we have to maintain the mortgage, 345 00:14:57,561 --> 00:14:59,881 we have to bring up the families, 346 00:14:59,881 --> 00:15:01,481 and I feel that I've had enough. 347 00:15:01,481 --> 00:15:04,201 I've had enough of working all these hours. 348 00:15:04,201 --> 00:15:06,681 Congestion charges, 40 pound a week now. 349 00:15:06,681 --> 00:15:10,321 Zero tolerance with the police with parking tickets. 350 00:15:10,321 --> 00:15:12,041 We're paying. 351 00:15:12,041 --> 00:15:15,161 Now someone's gettin' it at our expense. 352 00:15:16,801 --> 00:15:17,641 - Does it make you sad 353 00:15:17,641 --> 00:15:20,241 that you're gonna have to leave your roots, your country? 354 00:15:20,241 --> 00:15:23,121 - I can't even go out in the East End now to have a drink. 355 00:15:23,121 --> 00:15:26,601 The pubs are literally closing down. 356 00:15:26,601 --> 00:15:30,321 It's other cultures are buyin' all my old tradition up. 357 00:15:31,201 --> 00:15:33,481 Everyone likes their own culture, 358 00:15:33,481 --> 00:15:36,081 and I'm no different from anybody else, 359 00:15:36,081 --> 00:15:38,961 but being in England, if you suggest this, 360 00:15:38,961 --> 00:15:42,561 you are targeted as an oddball. 361 00:15:42,561 --> 00:15:44,161 Oh, you mustn't say that. 362 00:15:44,161 --> 00:15:46,161 Safety by numbers, eh, is that what they call it? 363 00:15:46,161 --> 00:15:47,001 - Definitely. 364 00:15:47,001 --> 00:15:48,801 - On the contrary, I would say, I'm sorry. 365 00:15:48,801 --> 00:15:51,521 If you don't like it, it's not to be offensive, 366 00:15:51,521 --> 00:15:52,441 it's just to let you know 367 00:15:52,441 --> 00:15:57,001 that my way of being brought up was all my own people, 368 00:15:57,001 --> 00:15:58,481 and I like being with me own people, 369 00:15:58,481 --> 00:15:59,761 and I'm a traditionalist. 370 00:16:00,801 --> 00:16:02,761 How much do you want play for, fiver? 371 00:16:03,801 --> 00:16:04,961 - 10 pesetas. 372 00:16:06,281 --> 00:16:07,481 Whoa! 373 00:16:07,481 --> 00:16:08,721 - What's the dream now? 374 00:16:08,721 --> 00:16:11,361 - It is to be happy, which I am. 375 00:16:11,361 --> 00:16:14,881 I am happy now, being healthy with all my family. 376 00:16:14,881 --> 00:16:16,641 We all want happy and health for our family. 377 00:16:16,641 --> 00:16:18,681 Anything else will be a bonus. 378 00:16:18,681 --> 00:16:20,121 And that's all I really want. 379 00:16:20,121 --> 00:16:21,441 And that's all I'm really after. 380 00:16:21,441 --> 00:16:23,321 I don't want no more or less than that. 381 00:16:23,321 --> 00:16:24,881 Oh. 382 00:16:24,881 --> 00:16:25,721 Unlucky Tony. 383 00:16:25,721 --> 00:16:27,401 - Unlucky. - Unlucky. 384 00:16:35,001 --> 00:16:38,841 - Some people from Africa come here but they, 385 00:16:38,841 --> 00:16:42,161 when they go, they put their clothes on. 386 00:16:43,121 --> 00:16:44,841 - Jackie, Lynn and Sue 387 00:16:45,681 --> 00:16:47,481 all grew up in the East End of London 388 00:16:47,481 --> 00:16:49,921 and were friends in the same junior school. 389 00:16:50,841 --> 00:16:54,081 - With this school, we do metalwork and woodwork, 390 00:16:54,081 --> 00:16:55,641 and the boys do cookery. 391 00:16:55,641 --> 00:17:00,641 - We had a teacher at school that his favourite ploy was, 392 00:17:01,521 --> 00:17:04,121 "All you girls want to do is walk out, 393 00:17:04,121 --> 00:17:05,481 "get married, have babies 394 00:17:05,481 --> 00:17:07,041 "and push a pram down the street 395 00:17:07,041 --> 00:17:09,921 "with a fag hanging outside your mouth." 396 00:17:09,921 --> 00:17:12,001 - I think that we all could have gone 397 00:17:12,001 --> 00:17:14,201 any way that we wanted to at the time 398 00:17:14,201 --> 00:17:15,961 within our capabilities. 399 00:17:15,961 --> 00:17:19,921 I mean, we just we chose our own jobs. 400 00:17:19,921 --> 00:17:21,681 But we only had a limited choice anyway. 401 00:17:21,681 --> 00:17:23,561 I mean, truth be told, I mean we-- 402 00:17:23,561 --> 00:17:24,401 - Yes, we did have 403 00:17:24,401 --> 00:17:25,241 a limited choice. - We didn't have a choice 404 00:17:25,241 --> 00:17:26,081 of private education 405 00:17:26,081 --> 00:17:27,881 because they couldn't have afforded it anyway. 406 00:17:27,881 --> 00:17:29,961 - Change is too much, Mike. 407 00:17:29,961 --> 00:17:34,321 Our lives are changing far too much, all of us. 408 00:17:34,321 --> 00:17:35,161 - Well, to be honest, 409 00:17:35,161 --> 00:17:37,441 when you look at the seven-year-old us, 410 00:17:37,441 --> 00:17:39,481 it's difficult to believe it is us. 411 00:17:39,481 --> 00:17:42,121 I mean, it's like it's someone else you're looking at, 412 00:17:42,121 --> 00:17:44,881 this little cute thing. 413 00:17:44,881 --> 00:17:46,041 I mean, I can't remember being-- 414 00:17:46,041 --> 00:17:47,241 - Well, I wasn't cute. 415 00:17:47,241 --> 00:17:49,961 I would like to get married when I grow up. 416 00:17:51,321 --> 00:17:53,281 Well, I don't know what sort of boy 417 00:17:53,281 --> 00:17:55,841 but I think one that. 418 00:17:56,801 --> 00:17:57,961 - Oh, no. 419 00:17:57,961 --> 00:18:01,001 - So, that's not got a lot of money 420 00:18:01,001 --> 00:18:05,281 but he has got some money, not a lot. 421 00:18:05,281 --> 00:18:07,001 - Have you got any boyfriends? 422 00:18:11,481 --> 00:18:12,721 - That's personal, innit? 423 00:18:15,201 --> 00:18:18,801 - By the time she was 21, Jackie had married Mick 424 00:18:18,801 --> 00:18:21,481 and moved to the outskirts of London. 425 00:18:21,481 --> 00:18:22,721 - It was horrific, really, 426 00:18:22,721 --> 00:18:24,521 what happened to the wedding cake. 427 00:18:24,521 --> 00:18:27,561 I mean, it was sitting right in between Mick and myself 428 00:18:28,561 --> 00:18:30,921 when suddenly, the columns just completely gave way 429 00:18:30,921 --> 00:18:33,041 and it just all sort of fell into one. 430 00:18:33,921 --> 00:18:37,921 I would say on average, 19 is probably too young. 431 00:18:40,561 --> 00:18:42,681 - By 35, she was divorced. 432 00:18:43,641 --> 00:18:47,601 - We decided ourselves, I mean just between the two of us, 433 00:18:47,601 --> 00:18:49,521 we knew it wasn't going any further. 434 00:18:51,241 --> 00:18:53,881 We both knew, I think, that at the end of the day, 435 00:18:53,881 --> 00:18:55,561 we would be happier leading our own lives. 436 00:18:55,561 --> 00:18:56,881 Hey, Jackie. 437 00:18:56,881 --> 00:18:59,121 - She and Mick had decided early on 438 00:18:59,121 --> 00:18:59,961 that they didn't want children. 439 00:18:59,961 --> 00:19:01,321 - Sometimes feel like really sick. 440 00:19:01,321 --> 00:19:05,361 - Basically, I would say because I'm far too selfish. 441 00:19:05,361 --> 00:19:09,321 I enjoy doing what I want when I want and how I want, 442 00:19:09,321 --> 00:19:11,881 and certainly at the moment, 443 00:19:11,881 --> 00:19:16,041 I can't see any way around that. 444 00:19:17,041 --> 00:19:17,881 Oh. 445 00:19:19,921 --> 00:19:21,881 And this one on. 446 00:19:21,881 --> 00:19:23,321 Here we go. 447 00:19:23,321 --> 00:19:24,641 Oh, yeah. 448 00:19:24,641 --> 00:19:28,321 Had a brief but very sweet relationship, 449 00:19:28,321 --> 00:19:30,561 the result of which was Charlie. 450 00:19:30,561 --> 00:19:32,441 Oi, give us a cuddle. 451 00:19:32,441 --> 00:19:34,881 I don't really want Charlie to be an only. 452 00:19:34,881 --> 00:19:37,081 I'd love him to have brothers and sisters, 453 00:19:37,081 --> 00:19:38,801 but not necessarily loads of 'em. 454 00:19:38,801 --> 00:19:41,881 Just, you know, one would do, actually. 455 00:19:41,881 --> 00:19:43,401 Right, Charlie, there's yours. 456 00:19:46,321 --> 00:19:47,761 And please eat it all up. 457 00:19:47,761 --> 00:19:49,041 - Oh. 458 00:19:50,081 --> 00:19:51,481 - And James. 459 00:19:51,481 --> 00:19:52,441 - Thanks, mum. 460 00:19:52,441 --> 00:19:54,121 - Good boy. 461 00:19:54,121 --> 00:19:55,761 And last but not least. 462 00:19:58,881 --> 00:20:00,281 Gonna eat that one for me? 463 00:20:00,281 --> 00:20:01,481 - After her relationship 464 00:20:01,481 --> 00:20:04,561 with Charlie's father ended, she met Ian, 465 00:20:04,561 --> 00:20:07,281 and they moved to Scotland and had two more sons. 466 00:20:09,401 --> 00:20:10,201 - James. 467 00:20:10,201 --> 00:20:11,041 - All right. 468 00:20:11,041 --> 00:20:13,121 - By 42, they had split up. 469 00:20:13,121 --> 00:20:13,961 - Lee. 470 00:20:18,361 --> 00:20:19,361 - Go on, Lee, go and get 'em. 471 00:20:21,161 --> 00:20:23,441 - At 49, despite the split, 472 00:20:23,441 --> 00:20:25,961 the family all live in the same area of Scotland. 473 00:20:28,121 --> 00:20:29,881 - There's your dad! 474 00:20:29,881 --> 00:20:32,641 Lee and Charlie's birthdays are only a month apart, 475 00:20:32,641 --> 00:20:34,321 so we tend to do something in between 476 00:20:34,321 --> 00:20:36,961 so that we celebrate both their birthdays. 477 00:20:36,961 --> 00:20:39,601 So we usually go somewhere like amusement park. 478 00:20:42,561 --> 00:20:45,201 - That Lee's got a lot of nerve, hasn't he? 479 00:20:45,201 --> 00:20:46,601 - And a little bit of bravado, I think. 480 00:20:46,601 --> 00:20:49,361 Because his older brothers had said no, 481 00:20:49,361 --> 00:20:51,521 I think he decided, I'm gonna do this one. 482 00:20:52,401 --> 00:20:54,921 - Yeah! 483 00:20:54,921 --> 00:20:55,761 Whoo! 484 00:20:55,761 --> 00:20:58,921 - Has Charlie shown any interest as to his father? 485 00:20:58,921 --> 00:20:59,761 - No. 486 00:21:01,481 --> 00:21:04,401 Ian's his father as far as he's concerned. 487 00:21:04,401 --> 00:21:06,001 He knows and the other boy knows, 488 00:21:06,001 --> 00:21:09,561 the whole family know that biologically, he's not, 489 00:21:10,401 --> 00:21:13,961 but in every respect, Ian is his father, 490 00:21:13,961 --> 00:21:14,801 always has been. 491 00:21:15,721 --> 00:21:19,161 He just done everything with him, been everything to him, 492 00:21:19,161 --> 00:21:20,801 taught him everything. 493 00:21:22,721 --> 00:21:23,641 - What would you do 494 00:21:23,641 --> 00:21:26,881 if you had lots of money, about two pounds? 495 00:21:26,881 --> 00:21:29,761 - I would buy meself a new nice house, 496 00:21:29,761 --> 00:21:34,721 you know, one that's all nice and comfy. 497 00:21:34,721 --> 00:21:36,641 - Oh, quite like that. 498 00:21:36,641 --> 00:21:39,241 - Jackie suffers from rheumatoid arthritis 499 00:21:39,241 --> 00:21:41,601 and lives off disability benefit. 500 00:21:41,601 --> 00:21:43,241 How is money for you? 501 00:21:43,241 --> 00:21:46,521 - Could do with more, as just about everybody would say, 502 00:21:47,721 --> 00:21:48,561 but we manage. 503 00:21:48,561 --> 00:21:50,961 We cut our cloth accordingly. 504 00:21:50,961 --> 00:21:54,121 You've got X amount, and that's what you do. 505 00:21:54,121 --> 00:21:55,201 I can imagine you in that. 506 00:21:55,201 --> 00:21:58,561 - Has Liz got anything to do with that? 507 00:21:58,561 --> 00:22:01,201 - Liz has always got something to do with that. 508 00:22:02,241 --> 00:22:05,681 Ian's her son, but she also says that I'm here 509 00:22:05,681 --> 00:22:07,561 and she's got three grandchildren here 510 00:22:08,481 --> 00:22:12,921 that she loves dearly, and she will be there for us. 511 00:22:13,801 --> 00:22:18,361 James has just had a trip to Alton Towers with the school. 512 00:22:18,361 --> 00:22:20,161 Then suddenly, she'll say, 513 00:22:20,161 --> 00:22:22,481 "You pay the trip, I'll give him his spending money", 514 00:22:22,481 --> 00:22:25,841 Which is brilliant because it just makes life easier for me. 515 00:22:27,481 --> 00:22:29,081 - Now, you've moved in the last seven years. 516 00:22:29,081 --> 00:22:30,401 Tell me about that. 517 00:22:30,401 --> 00:22:32,481 - Because of the arthritis that I've got, 518 00:22:32,481 --> 00:22:34,521 I needed to come to the ground floor. 519 00:22:36,161 --> 00:22:38,121 And this particular area that I'm in now 520 00:22:38,121 --> 00:22:39,281 is an area that I like. 521 00:22:39,281 --> 00:22:42,241 It's close to Liz, my mother-in-law, 522 00:22:42,241 --> 00:22:46,081 so from that point of view, it suits. 523 00:22:46,081 --> 00:22:50,201 The school's across the road for the boys, good neighbours, 524 00:22:50,201 --> 00:22:52,801 which makes a difference wherever your property is. 525 00:22:54,201 --> 00:22:57,281 It's how the East End used to be about 30 years ago. 526 00:22:57,281 --> 00:22:58,201 Doors used to be open, 527 00:22:58,201 --> 00:23:00,441 the neighbours all watched for each other. 528 00:23:00,441 --> 00:23:01,281 If one neighbour had a problem, 529 00:23:01,281 --> 00:23:02,161 the other neighbours helped out. 530 00:23:02,161 --> 00:23:03,801 That's how it is here. 531 00:23:04,761 --> 00:23:07,481 That's what this place is like, it's like a village. 532 00:23:07,481 --> 00:23:08,961 - 80, 85, 90-- 533 00:23:08,961 --> 00:23:10,521 - We deal with the problems with the boys 534 00:23:10,521 --> 00:23:12,041 as and when they arise. 535 00:23:12,041 --> 00:23:14,121 I mean, you've always got the problem of drink 536 00:23:14,121 --> 00:23:17,641 and drugs and smoking and not smoking 537 00:23:17,641 --> 00:23:20,641 and that sort of thing. 538 00:23:20,641 --> 00:23:24,641 I mean, Charlie's of an age now where I can't mother him 539 00:23:24,641 --> 00:23:26,361 but I can't be his friend, either. 540 00:23:28,401 --> 00:23:30,481 He wants to work, he wants to leave school, 541 00:23:30,481 --> 00:23:33,961 and he wants to get an apprenticeship to car mechanics 542 00:23:33,961 --> 00:23:37,481 but the chances of him doing that are probably very slim. 543 00:23:37,481 --> 00:23:40,081 - Hey, some-- - Lee, take your time, babe. 544 00:23:40,081 --> 00:23:41,201 You'll make yourself ill. 545 00:23:41,201 --> 00:23:42,481 - Don't care. 546 00:23:42,481 --> 00:23:45,201 - James tends to be a bit of a computer freak. 547 00:23:46,281 --> 00:23:51,281 He wants to produce and make his own games. 548 00:23:51,441 --> 00:23:53,201 - That looks just like your brain, mush. 549 00:23:53,201 --> 00:23:56,081 - Lee tends to be, like, the outspoken one 550 00:23:56,081 --> 00:23:58,641 and a bit like I was at his age, really. 551 00:23:59,601 --> 00:24:02,081 In fact, he's very much like I was at his age. 552 00:24:02,081 --> 00:24:03,481 - Is that a worry? 553 00:24:06,081 --> 00:24:07,561 - I think that's terrible. 554 00:24:07,561 --> 00:24:09,521 How dare you say that to me? 555 00:24:09,521 --> 00:24:10,481 Is that a worry? 556 00:24:10,481 --> 00:24:12,081 Why would that be a worry? 557 00:24:12,081 --> 00:24:13,881 Do you think I've turned out badly? 558 00:24:13,881 --> 00:24:15,641 - No, but sometimes when you look at yourself, 559 00:24:15,641 --> 00:24:17,161 you don't always see things you like in yourself, 560 00:24:17,161 --> 00:24:19,721 and then you see them in your child and you think-- 561 00:24:19,721 --> 00:24:23,201 - Yeah, but I never said he'd picked up all of my traits. 562 00:24:23,201 --> 00:24:26,321 I actually think he's picked up probably the best. 563 00:24:27,441 --> 00:24:28,721 If you're not gonna play nicely, 564 00:24:28,721 --> 00:24:29,921 right, go to bed, then. 565 00:24:29,921 --> 00:24:30,721 - No! 566 00:24:30,721 --> 00:24:34,921 - He has a temper that isn't as bad as when he was younger, 567 00:24:34,921 --> 00:24:37,601 but it is something that he knows about 568 00:24:37,601 --> 00:24:40,801 and he tries very hard to control. 569 00:24:40,801 --> 00:24:43,081 - Does your temper get you into trouble? 570 00:24:44,801 --> 00:24:47,401 - You're probably the best one to answer that, does it? 571 00:24:48,601 --> 00:24:52,041 I mean, you and I have had arguments on occasions. 572 00:24:52,041 --> 00:24:53,121 - Did you meet enough men 573 00:24:53,121 --> 00:24:55,481 before you decided who to marry? 574 00:24:55,481 --> 00:24:57,961 - I mean, what do you mean by settle down? 575 00:24:57,961 --> 00:25:01,001 I mean, if you think that getting married, 576 00:25:01,001 --> 00:25:03,161 as far as we're concerned, is a case of going to work, 577 00:25:03,161 --> 00:25:05,241 come home, cook tea for hubby, going to bed, 578 00:25:05,241 --> 00:25:09,161 getting up, going to work, you're totally mistaken. 579 00:25:09,161 --> 00:25:10,001 The whole thing you-- 580 00:25:10,001 --> 00:25:11,321 - I like it when you shout at me. 581 00:25:11,321 --> 00:25:13,721 - I'm not sure you do, really. 582 00:25:13,721 --> 00:25:14,961 I mean I don't know. 583 00:25:14,961 --> 00:25:16,281 What happened at 21? 584 00:25:17,721 --> 00:25:21,001 You asked me if I'd had enough experience with men 585 00:25:21,001 --> 00:25:23,041 before I got married, 586 00:25:23,041 --> 00:25:25,441 and I thought that was actually an insulting question, 587 00:25:25,441 --> 00:25:27,561 and I got very angry, 588 00:25:27,561 --> 00:25:30,561 and we actually stopped filming because of it. 589 00:25:30,561 --> 00:25:33,041 And if you look at the tapes of me at 21, 590 00:25:33,041 --> 00:25:35,681 I am sitting, and to all intents and purposes, 591 00:25:35,681 --> 00:25:37,561 I might as well have not been there. 592 00:25:39,401 --> 00:25:43,881 But I was really angry that you even thought you could get, 593 00:25:43,881 --> 00:25:45,281 you wouldn't have asked 594 00:25:45,281 --> 00:25:48,041 some of the other people in this programme that question. 595 00:25:49,561 --> 00:25:53,041 You will edit this programme as you see fit. 596 00:25:53,041 --> 00:25:54,841 I've got no control over that. 597 00:25:55,801 --> 00:25:59,001 You definitely come across as this is your idea 598 00:25:59,001 --> 00:26:02,401 of what you want to do and how you see us, 599 00:26:02,401 --> 00:26:05,121 and that's how you portray us. 600 00:26:05,121 --> 00:26:08,561 This one maybe, maybe the first one that's about us 601 00:26:08,561 --> 00:26:10,641 rather than about your perception of us. 602 00:26:10,641 --> 00:26:13,761 - So how up to now have I got you wrong? 603 00:26:13,761 --> 00:26:15,161 - How have you got me wrong? 604 00:26:16,601 --> 00:26:18,561 The last one was very much based on 605 00:26:20,081 --> 00:26:23,681 the sympathy and the illness that I've got 606 00:26:23,681 --> 00:26:27,441 and what I may or may not be able to do. 607 00:26:27,441 --> 00:26:30,521 It should have been about what I can do, 608 00:26:30,521 --> 00:26:34,841 what I am doing, what I will do. 609 00:26:34,841 --> 00:26:36,361 Don't make that mistake, Mike. 610 00:26:36,361 --> 00:26:37,841 I am no way, 611 00:26:37,841 --> 00:26:41,481 I am down and I am depressed about my illness, 612 00:26:41,481 --> 00:26:44,601 but I'm certainly not down and depressed about my life. 613 00:26:44,601 --> 00:26:45,441 And there are a lot of the times 614 00:26:45,441 --> 00:26:49,081 that I sit and I cringe when I watch those programmes, 615 00:26:49,081 --> 00:26:52,081 not just for me, but for other people. 616 00:26:53,241 --> 00:26:55,561 You can ask me about Ian, and you know full well 617 00:26:55,561 --> 00:26:57,761 I'm gonna say to you it's none of your business, 618 00:26:57,761 --> 00:26:59,641 I'm not talking about it. 619 00:26:59,641 --> 00:27:01,801 Now, there are people in this programme that don't do that, 620 00:27:01,801 --> 00:27:03,881 that quite of their own free will, 621 00:27:03,881 --> 00:27:07,801 will talk about their marriages or their divorces 622 00:27:07,801 --> 00:27:09,961 or the state of their lives 623 00:27:09,961 --> 00:27:11,481 but I don't think you should be into that. 624 00:27:11,481 --> 00:27:14,161 I don't think you should even be asking that. 625 00:27:14,161 --> 00:27:15,481 - It's part of people's lives, 626 00:27:15,481 --> 00:27:17,561 and this programme is about people's lives. 627 00:27:18,801 --> 00:27:20,561 - Yeah, but that's, 628 00:27:20,561 --> 00:27:22,121 see, to me, that's a part of my life 629 00:27:22,121 --> 00:27:23,961 that will never go on this programme. 630 00:27:23,961 --> 00:27:27,681 You know I'd married, my ex-husband never took part in this. 631 00:27:27,681 --> 00:27:30,081 My partner now will never take part in this. 632 00:27:30,081 --> 00:27:31,161 - But that's not my fault. 633 00:27:31,161 --> 00:27:34,401 - No, but that's because that's the way I want it. 634 00:27:34,401 --> 00:27:36,721 But it still doesn't stop you 635 00:27:36,721 --> 00:27:38,721 trying to get that information from me. 636 00:27:41,321 --> 00:27:42,961 - So what would you like to talk about 637 00:27:42,961 --> 00:27:44,201 if you want me to represent you? 638 00:27:44,201 --> 00:27:46,801 We've talked a bit about the children. 639 00:27:46,801 --> 00:27:48,721 - What I want to do. 640 00:27:48,721 --> 00:27:49,841 What I hope to do. 641 00:27:53,121 --> 00:27:57,001 I just don't want that personal conversation. 642 00:27:57,001 --> 00:27:58,161 - Okay, well, let's talk about that, 643 00:27:58,161 --> 00:28:00,721 what you hope to do and what you hope for the boys. 644 00:28:01,681 --> 00:28:03,321 - What I hope to do. 645 00:28:05,241 --> 00:28:09,641 I'd like to go back to school 646 00:28:11,961 --> 00:28:14,881 so that I can hold a conversation with anybody in the world 647 00:28:14,881 --> 00:28:17,321 and know what I'm talking about. 648 00:28:17,321 --> 00:28:20,441 So that I'm not stuck, I know a little bit about that 649 00:28:20,441 --> 00:28:22,241 but I don't really know enough. 650 00:28:22,241 --> 00:28:23,401 I'd love to know... 651 00:28:24,561 --> 00:28:26,601 Actually, I'd really love to start my education 652 00:28:26,601 --> 00:28:27,441 all over again. 653 00:28:28,281 --> 00:28:30,641 My mum, 'cause she got five girls, 654 00:28:30,641 --> 00:28:33,961 she had seven years' bad luck 655 00:28:33,961 --> 00:28:36,161 that's why she's got five girls. 656 00:28:36,161 --> 00:28:39,561 I'd like to be able to have a happy family. 657 00:28:39,561 --> 00:28:41,481 I mean, I know that it's not possible 658 00:28:41,481 --> 00:28:43,521 to be happy all the time, 659 00:28:43,521 --> 00:28:45,881 but as much of the time that it was possible. 660 00:28:45,881 --> 00:28:47,241 I don't know what Suzy's had. 661 00:28:47,241 --> 00:28:49,841 What's Suzy had that I haven't had? 662 00:28:49,841 --> 00:28:50,721 I mean, until I know that-- 663 00:28:50,721 --> 00:28:52,161 - Are you different 664 00:28:52,161 --> 00:28:54,241 from what I should have expected 665 00:28:54,241 --> 00:28:56,681 at seven and 14 and 21? 666 00:28:56,681 --> 00:28:58,481 - Maybe not enough, but I've got it. 667 00:28:58,481 --> 00:29:00,041 I think I'm actually more intelligent 668 00:29:00,041 --> 00:29:02,081 than you thought I would be. 669 00:29:02,081 --> 00:29:05,561 I have reached a level 670 00:29:08,201 --> 00:29:10,881 in my life that I'm happy with, 671 00:29:10,881 --> 00:29:14,441 and I enjoy being, I enjoy being me 672 00:29:15,641 --> 00:29:18,281 but I don't think you ever really expected me 673 00:29:18,281 --> 00:29:20,441 to turn out the way I have. 674 00:29:31,401 --> 00:29:34,081 If we did all love Geoffrey 675 00:29:34,081 --> 00:29:35,641 and we all want to marry him. 676 00:29:35,641 --> 00:29:36,481 - Yeah. 677 00:29:36,481 --> 00:29:41,041 - I think I know the one that he likes best, and that's her. 678 00:29:41,041 --> 00:29:46,041 - I don't think I'd get married too early. 679 00:29:46,401 --> 00:29:47,881 I'd like to have a full life first and-- 680 00:29:47,881 --> 00:29:48,721 - I'd like to enjoy 681 00:29:48,721 --> 00:29:50,721 myself before I-- - Meet people and, yeah. 682 00:29:50,721 --> 00:29:53,401 Before you can commit yourself to a family. 683 00:29:53,401 --> 00:29:54,681 Marriage means a different thing to me. 684 00:29:54,681 --> 00:29:56,201 I've still got my ideals about marriage. 685 00:29:56,201 --> 00:29:58,201 I don't know what it's all about. 686 00:29:58,201 --> 00:30:00,881 - Sue was 24 when she married Billy. 687 00:30:00,881 --> 00:30:03,921 They had two children, William and Catherine. 688 00:30:03,921 --> 00:30:05,481 - I think that to get married young, 689 00:30:05,481 --> 00:30:07,161 there must be things that you miss. 690 00:30:07,161 --> 00:30:11,641 You must miss that crucial stage of being yourself 691 00:30:11,641 --> 00:30:12,961 because the minute you get married, 692 00:30:12,961 --> 00:30:15,601 you're no longer a single being. 693 00:30:15,601 --> 00:30:19,081 You're a partnership, and that should be the idea behind it. 694 00:30:19,081 --> 00:30:21,041 - By the time she was 34, 695 00:30:21,041 --> 00:30:22,721 she and Billy had divorced. 696 00:30:24,041 --> 00:30:28,561 - I've never sat down and thought, well, what was it? 697 00:30:28,561 --> 00:30:30,441 Was it this, was it that? 698 00:30:30,441 --> 00:30:32,561 I just knew it wasn't working. 699 00:30:32,561 --> 00:30:35,281 There have been relationships when I could have settled 700 00:30:35,281 --> 00:30:37,241 but they didn't feel quite right, 701 00:30:37,241 --> 00:30:41,481 so I've always come away and pulled away 702 00:30:41,481 --> 00:30:44,921 and just waited until the right one come along, 703 00:30:46,481 --> 00:30:47,721 if they ever do. 704 00:30:47,721 --> 00:30:52,681 ♪ Don't you remember you told me you loved me, baby ♪ 705 00:30:52,681 --> 00:30:53,761 ♪ You said you'd be coming back ♪ 706 00:30:53,761 --> 00:30:56,921 - At 42, when we filmed Sue in the karaoke bar, 707 00:30:56,921 --> 00:30:59,001 she brought Glen along to watch her sing. 708 00:30:59,001 --> 00:31:02,281 ♪ Baby, baby, baby, oh, baby ♪ 709 00:31:02,281 --> 00:31:04,321 We've just met and things are going well, 710 00:31:04,321 --> 00:31:08,161 but now obviously things have gone very well. 711 00:31:10,481 --> 00:31:11,721 - Is this love? 712 00:31:11,721 --> 00:31:12,881 - Oh, I think so, yeah. 713 00:31:12,881 --> 00:31:15,361 I mean, we've known each other for a long, long time 714 00:31:15,361 --> 00:31:17,041 before the seven years, 715 00:31:17,041 --> 00:31:19,481 and we've always, always liked each other. 716 00:31:21,441 --> 00:31:22,321 - He's good looking. 717 00:31:22,321 --> 00:31:23,161 - He's very good looking. 718 00:31:23,161 --> 00:31:24,561 He's not bad, is he? 719 00:31:24,561 --> 00:31:28,481 Everyone says he looks like Paul Weller. 720 00:31:28,481 --> 00:31:29,321 Whether that's true or not, 721 00:31:29,321 --> 00:31:31,241 especially now he's growing his hair. 722 00:31:31,241 --> 00:31:33,601 - Susan most of all likes Lesley. 723 00:31:33,601 --> 00:31:35,041 - Do I? - I mean before. 724 00:31:35,041 --> 00:31:36,681 - You said. 725 00:31:36,681 --> 00:31:38,601 She keeps changing her mind, though. 726 00:31:38,601 --> 00:31:41,401 - Yeah, I don't know which one, really. 727 00:31:41,401 --> 00:31:43,921 'Cause everything's not that cut and dried. 728 00:31:43,921 --> 00:31:45,801 It's not either a career or family or, 729 00:31:46,721 --> 00:31:47,561 but it's what's in the middle. 730 00:31:47,561 --> 00:31:50,561 Am I just gonna carry on as I am now for, 731 00:31:50,561 --> 00:31:54,721 and end up on a shelf or am I just gonna get married, 732 00:31:54,721 --> 00:31:55,801 could be any day? 733 00:31:55,801 --> 00:31:58,241 I've been married, and I've not got that urgency. 734 00:31:58,241 --> 00:32:01,081 Glen, we sort of say maybe we will. 735 00:32:01,081 --> 00:32:03,481 We're engaged, we're committed. 736 00:32:03,481 --> 00:32:05,001 We've bought a house together, 737 00:32:05,001 --> 00:32:06,761 and to me, that's a big commitment. 738 00:32:07,761 --> 00:32:11,161 Every house needs money spending on it when you move in. 739 00:32:11,161 --> 00:32:14,241 To have a wedding, you gotta put some cash into it. 740 00:32:14,241 --> 00:32:15,521 When I got married, 741 00:32:15,521 --> 00:32:18,881 the primary reason was because I wanted to have a child. 742 00:32:18,881 --> 00:32:21,681 The two, to me, went together. 743 00:32:22,561 --> 00:32:23,601 - Have you and Glen 744 00:32:23,601 --> 00:32:24,841 thought of having your own child? 745 00:32:24,841 --> 00:32:28,401 - Well, Glen got with me when we got together, 746 00:32:28,401 --> 00:32:30,481 I should say, when I was in my 40s, 747 00:32:30,481 --> 00:32:31,921 and you don't have a baby 748 00:32:31,921 --> 00:32:34,281 when you've just started a relationship. 749 00:32:34,281 --> 00:32:36,041 I didn't want to do all that again. 750 00:32:36,041 --> 00:32:38,201 I would have loved to have had a baby with him 751 00:32:38,201 --> 00:32:40,161 'cause he would make a wonderful parent 752 00:32:41,041 --> 00:32:42,201 but the timing was off. 753 00:32:45,241 --> 00:32:46,401 - So she's your baby? 754 00:32:46,401 --> 00:32:48,241 - She's my new baby, yeah. 755 00:32:48,241 --> 00:32:51,321 Yeah, my kids are my babies, but she's my new baby. 756 00:32:51,321 --> 00:32:53,801 She's our baby, mine and Glen's. 757 00:32:58,161 --> 00:32:59,161 She's a wonderful terrier. 758 00:32:59,161 --> 00:33:01,161 She's got such character. 759 00:33:01,161 --> 00:33:02,001 - What does she do? 760 00:33:02,001 --> 00:33:05,481 - Well, she watches TV with us. 761 00:33:05,481 --> 00:33:07,441 She's got her own favourite programmes. 762 00:33:09,281 --> 00:33:11,761 And she adores Rolf Harris, 763 00:33:11,761 --> 00:33:14,241 absolutely adores "Animal Hospital". 764 00:33:14,241 --> 00:33:18,041 She's at the top of the house, and the music comes on, 765 00:33:18,041 --> 00:33:21,001 she runs down the stairs and puts herself in front of the TV 766 00:33:21,001 --> 00:33:22,401 for Rolf Harris. 767 00:33:25,921 --> 00:33:26,721 - So, the house looks nice. 768 00:33:26,721 --> 00:33:27,601 You pleased with it? 769 00:33:27,601 --> 00:33:28,521 - I am very pleased with it. 770 00:33:28,521 --> 00:33:30,721 It's a lovely step for us. 771 00:33:30,721 --> 00:33:33,521 We feel like we've got more space around us, 772 00:33:33,521 --> 00:33:36,161 and we've got to do everything inside, 773 00:33:36,161 --> 00:33:38,561 but we can build on it, and that's what we want. 774 00:33:39,561 --> 00:33:42,601 I've been promising to have a housewarming party 775 00:33:42,601 --> 00:33:43,441 since we've moved in. 776 00:33:43,441 --> 00:33:44,401 We've been here four months now, 777 00:33:44,401 --> 00:33:45,841 so I thought it was about time we did that. 778 00:33:45,841 --> 00:33:48,681 So people are just starting to arrive now. 779 00:33:49,961 --> 00:33:52,481 - So, you left the East End, why? 780 00:33:52,481 --> 00:33:56,001 - Well, I've always wanted to move out, 781 00:33:56,001 --> 00:33:59,561 but you don't do that or the opportunity isn't there 782 00:33:59,561 --> 00:34:01,881 when you are own your own with two kids. 783 00:34:01,881 --> 00:34:03,321 I wish I had done it before. 784 00:34:03,321 --> 00:34:05,561 The timing, it's timing, you know. 785 00:34:05,561 --> 00:34:07,841 Now was the right time, obviously. 786 00:34:07,841 --> 00:34:10,161 The East End has changed, it's changed a lot. 787 00:34:10,161 --> 00:34:11,841 - He was even playing tie the tooth. 788 00:34:13,881 --> 00:34:14,721 - Mum comes down to me. 789 00:34:14,721 --> 00:34:15,561 It's so easy for them. 790 00:34:15,561 --> 00:34:17,481 They can jump on a train, 791 00:34:17,481 --> 00:34:20,321 and the station's within walking distance 792 00:34:20,321 --> 00:34:23,841 so it's worked out wonderfully well. 793 00:34:23,841 --> 00:34:25,961 - Well, some people are just born into rich families 794 00:34:25,961 --> 00:34:27,361 and they're lucky. 795 00:34:27,361 --> 00:34:28,441 - I don't see why they should have the luck 796 00:34:28,441 --> 00:34:30,721 when people have worked all their lives 797 00:34:30,721 --> 00:34:33,001 and haven't got half as much as what they have. 798 00:34:33,001 --> 00:34:34,761 It just don't seem fair. 799 00:34:34,761 --> 00:34:37,041 - So have you moved up a class now? 800 00:34:40,201 --> 00:34:41,681 - That's difficult to say. 801 00:34:41,681 --> 00:34:43,121 Up a class. 802 00:34:44,321 --> 00:34:46,041 I suppose it feels like that to me. 803 00:34:46,041 --> 00:34:48,521 No, there ain't no need for food, that's gonna be their. 804 00:34:48,521 --> 00:34:50,361 Now, you've got the sense of pride, 805 00:34:50,361 --> 00:34:51,521 you've got your own house. 806 00:34:51,521 --> 00:34:54,201 I feel like I'm building for the future. 807 00:34:56,881 --> 00:34:59,321 I've been a single parent for a long while. 808 00:34:59,321 --> 00:35:01,721 I've brought them up on my own, really, 809 00:35:01,721 --> 00:35:05,241 because Catherine was only two when Bill left. 810 00:35:05,241 --> 00:35:08,281 It's been extremely hard and it's been, 811 00:35:08,281 --> 00:35:10,961 sometimes, it's been very lonely. 812 00:35:10,961 --> 00:35:11,961 - I only had to have one filling, right. 813 00:35:11,961 --> 00:35:14,881 That was about the only thing that I had done. 814 00:35:14,881 --> 00:35:17,881 - William, he's a computer addict. 815 00:35:17,881 --> 00:35:19,081 He works in the industry 816 00:35:19,081 --> 00:35:23,081 and he also constantly has a computer on indoors. 817 00:35:23,081 --> 00:35:24,881 - This one's facing in the windows. 818 00:35:24,881 --> 00:35:26,641 - He could have gone to university, 819 00:35:26,641 --> 00:35:28,641 and he knows that and I know that, 820 00:35:28,641 --> 00:35:31,321 and I do regret that for him. 821 00:35:32,201 --> 00:35:33,161 But I've been there. 822 00:35:33,161 --> 00:35:36,521 I can just remember I didn't wanna do that, either. 823 00:35:38,681 --> 00:35:40,881 And Catherine's temping 824 00:35:40,881 --> 00:35:43,641 because she wants to do a bit of travelling next year. 825 00:35:45,041 --> 00:35:47,201 People say she's me reincarnated. 826 00:35:47,201 --> 00:35:49,801 I mean, she looks a bit like me 827 00:35:49,801 --> 00:35:52,521 and her mannerisms are exactly like me, 828 00:35:52,521 --> 00:35:56,641 and she likes to enjoy herself. 829 00:35:56,641 --> 00:35:57,481 - Get to aviation. 830 00:35:57,481 --> 00:35:58,401 - I wanted to get-- 831 00:35:58,401 --> 00:36:00,681 - To walk into a relationship 832 00:36:00,681 --> 00:36:02,801 with someone who's got two teenagers, 833 00:36:02,801 --> 00:36:05,041 it must have been very difficult for him, 834 00:36:05,041 --> 00:36:07,121 and they do clash occasionally. 835 00:36:08,321 --> 00:36:12,161 I absolutely hate it because I'm just an easy-going person 836 00:36:12,161 --> 00:36:13,361 and I don't like strife. 837 00:36:14,361 --> 00:36:17,481 They are doing things the way I've brought them up, 838 00:36:17,481 --> 00:36:20,241 which isn't the way that Glen would like things to be done, 839 00:36:20,241 --> 00:36:24,281 so you've got to learn to live together in the same house. 840 00:36:24,281 --> 00:36:27,441 It will always be a learning curve. 841 00:36:28,521 --> 00:36:29,801 I'm a peacemaker. 842 00:36:30,921 --> 00:36:31,761 - When the children 843 00:36:31,761 --> 00:36:33,641 were old enough to go to school, 844 00:36:33,641 --> 00:36:37,081 Sue went back to work and had a series of office jobs. 845 00:36:37,081 --> 00:36:39,161 She now helps run the MA courses 846 00:36:39,161 --> 00:36:41,601 in the legal faculty of the university of London. 847 00:36:42,881 --> 00:36:47,641 - Still work for the college but we moved to Central London. 848 00:36:47,641 --> 00:36:52,641 Now I am sort of the main administrator for the programme 849 00:36:52,761 --> 00:36:54,361 instead of an assistant 850 00:36:54,361 --> 00:36:57,241 and I've got a couple of people that help me with that. 851 00:36:57,241 --> 00:36:59,641 Hey, could you fax that to Mary for me, please? 852 00:36:59,641 --> 00:37:00,961 Thanks. 853 00:37:00,961 --> 00:37:02,361 - So you like the responsibility? 854 00:37:02,361 --> 00:37:04,441 - Yeah, I love the responsibility. 855 00:37:04,441 --> 00:37:07,281 I think I was born for the responsibility. 856 00:37:07,281 --> 00:37:08,641 Yeah, I love it. 857 00:37:08,641 --> 00:37:09,961 - Well, I've never been abroad but-- 858 00:37:09,961 --> 00:37:10,841 - No, nor have I. 859 00:37:10,841 --> 00:37:12,121 - I have, I have. 860 00:37:12,121 --> 00:37:14,001 - Oh, yeah, 'cause you went on that cruise, didn't you? 861 00:37:14,001 --> 00:37:15,561 - Yeah. 862 00:37:15,561 --> 00:37:18,241 Once a year we go to Cornwall or Devon. 863 00:37:18,241 --> 00:37:20,561 We try to find a different spot every year 864 00:37:20,561 --> 00:37:21,881 and we just bring the dog. 865 00:37:22,721 --> 00:37:24,361 It's just such a lovely place. 866 00:37:24,361 --> 00:37:27,521 Every time you turn a corner, there's a different sight, 867 00:37:27,521 --> 00:37:28,881 there's a different, 868 00:37:28,881 --> 00:37:30,561 you just never know what you're gonna find. 869 00:37:30,561 --> 00:37:33,081 Everything's just so beautiful. 870 00:37:35,321 --> 00:37:40,041 We'd both had childhood holidays here and good memories, 871 00:37:40,041 --> 00:37:41,761 and we decided to come back, 872 00:37:41,761 --> 00:37:43,401 and we've been coming ever since. 873 00:37:44,481 --> 00:37:47,201 It's nice for us just to be a couple for a week. 874 00:37:49,641 --> 00:37:52,641 When we retire, or maybe before, if we get lucky, 875 00:37:52,641 --> 00:37:55,801 then this is the sort of place we'd like to come to. 876 00:37:55,801 --> 00:37:56,961 That little one there, 877 00:37:56,961 --> 00:37:58,161 right in the middle nearest the beach, 878 00:37:58,161 --> 00:38:01,161 that would be ideal, absolute perfect. 879 00:38:01,161 --> 00:38:02,881 The perfect place. 880 00:38:15,081 --> 00:38:19,041 - Vesto, vestas, vest. 881 00:38:19,041 --> 00:38:20,081 Vestat. 882 00:38:20,081 --> 00:38:23,081 Vestamus, vestatis, vestant. 883 00:38:23,081 --> 00:38:24,481 - Here, speak up. 884 00:38:24,481 --> 00:38:26,681 Fill out the gaps on the board there. 885 00:38:26,681 --> 00:38:27,681 - When he was seven, 886 00:38:27,681 --> 00:38:30,321 Bruce was at a preparatory boarding school. 887 00:38:30,321 --> 00:38:33,441 At 14, St. Paul's in London. 888 00:38:33,441 --> 00:38:37,281 - They don't sort of enforce being upper class 889 00:38:37,281 --> 00:38:40,561 and things like that at St. Paul's. 890 00:38:40,561 --> 00:38:43,641 They suggest that you don't have long hair 891 00:38:43,641 --> 00:38:45,721 and they do get it cut if, 892 00:38:45,721 --> 00:38:50,321 and they teach you to be reasonably well-mannered 893 00:38:50,321 --> 00:38:53,401 but not to sniff on the poorer people. 894 00:38:55,921 --> 00:38:58,681 - At 21, he was in his last year at Oxford, 895 00:38:58,681 --> 00:38:59,761 reading maths. 896 00:39:00,681 --> 00:39:02,721 - You can show that this is irreducible. 897 00:39:03,641 --> 00:39:05,161 Then you do a transformation 898 00:39:05,161 --> 00:39:07,481 on this polynomial X equal to T plus two. 899 00:39:07,481 --> 00:39:09,561 - Good, that's a nice way of doing it, 900 00:39:09,561 --> 00:39:11,841 particularly using Eisenstein down here. 901 00:39:11,841 --> 00:39:13,041 His test is very powerful. 902 00:39:13,041 --> 00:39:13,881 - Yes. 903 00:39:13,881 --> 00:39:14,721 Chris Awanabe. 904 00:39:14,721 --> 00:39:15,681 - Yes, sir! 905 00:39:15,681 --> 00:39:16,521 - Moma Naly. 906 00:39:16,521 --> 00:39:18,281 - Yes, sir! - At 28, 907 00:39:18,281 --> 00:39:20,641 Bruce was teaching maths in East London. 908 00:39:20,641 --> 00:39:22,801 - Well, I'll go into Africa 909 00:39:22,801 --> 00:39:27,801 and try and teach people who are not civilised 910 00:39:28,041 --> 00:39:30,761 to be more or less good. 911 00:39:34,801 --> 00:39:37,641 - At 35, he was teaching in Silet 912 00:39:37,641 --> 00:39:39,081 in Northern Bangladesh. 913 00:39:40,481 --> 00:39:43,281 - And I also got the chance to learn a bit of Bangla 914 00:39:43,281 --> 00:39:44,841 which is very difficult. 915 00:39:44,841 --> 00:39:46,321 Not doing very well at. 916 00:39:46,321 --> 00:39:49,441 - Bangladesh, Bangladesh, Bangladesh. 917 00:39:49,441 --> 00:39:50,641 - Bangladesh. 918 00:39:50,641 --> 00:39:51,481 - Bangladesh. 919 00:39:51,481 --> 00:39:52,601 - Bangladesh. 920 00:39:52,601 --> 00:39:55,241 - Before you do anything, you have to make sure-- 921 00:39:55,241 --> 00:39:58,321 - By 42, Bruce was back in the East End 922 00:39:58,321 --> 00:40:00,281 running the maths department at a girls' school. 923 00:40:00,281 --> 00:40:01,321 - And then after naught hours, 924 00:40:01,321 --> 00:40:03,841 you can see that it would be 60 litres. 925 00:40:03,841 --> 00:40:05,761 Okay, now you wanna put this information-- 926 00:40:21,881 --> 00:40:24,921 - At 49, he's teaching at St. Albans, 927 00:40:24,921 --> 00:40:26,961 a large boys' independent school 928 00:40:26,961 --> 00:40:28,681 which has girls in the sixth form. 929 00:40:29,921 --> 00:40:31,841 - I sing in the choir, that happens twice a week. 930 00:40:31,841 --> 00:40:34,601 On Mondays and Fridays we go to the abbey, 931 00:40:34,601 --> 00:40:38,041 because in the early days, the school was in the abbey, 932 00:40:38,041 --> 00:40:39,881 going back to 948. 933 00:40:41,401 --> 00:40:42,241 - 948? 934 00:40:42,241 --> 00:40:44,961 - Yes, so the head quite likes to say 935 00:40:44,961 --> 00:40:47,361 we're in our third millennium, you know. 936 00:40:48,281 --> 00:40:50,241 - So the school's over a thousand years old? 937 00:40:50,241 --> 00:40:52,321 - Yes, in one form or another. 938 00:40:52,321 --> 00:40:54,481 You have to make X the subject of this equation, 939 00:40:54,481 --> 00:40:55,521 you gotta get X on its own. 940 00:40:55,521 --> 00:40:56,721 So what's the first thing we do? 941 00:40:56,721 --> 00:40:58,041 - Multiply both sides by three. 942 00:40:58,041 --> 00:40:59,041 - You don't multiply by three. 943 00:40:59,041 --> 00:41:00,241 - Divide by three. - Divide, sorry. 944 00:41:00,241 --> 00:41:01,241 - Okay, so-- 945 00:41:01,241 --> 00:41:02,081 - Tell me then 946 00:41:02,081 --> 00:41:04,601 what's exciting about teaching here for you. 947 00:41:04,601 --> 00:41:07,761 - There is a higher academic level to teach 948 00:41:09,081 --> 00:41:12,281 and then you can see pupils at a more developed level, 949 00:41:12,281 --> 00:41:13,961 that flash of recognition 950 00:41:13,961 --> 00:41:16,441 and then engendering their love of the subject 951 00:41:16,441 --> 00:41:19,601 that I had at their age. 952 00:41:19,601 --> 00:41:21,641 There is a class society, 953 00:41:21,641 --> 00:41:26,641 and I think public schools may help its continuance. 954 00:41:27,041 --> 00:41:29,761 So you're in the lead, you see, because here-- 955 00:41:29,761 --> 00:41:32,321 - Has it been a kind of compromise 956 00:41:32,321 --> 00:41:34,601 of political principles for you, this? 957 00:41:35,601 --> 00:41:38,401 - Well, I would say have a million angels 958 00:41:38,401 --> 00:41:39,641 in front of every teacher 959 00:41:39,641 --> 00:41:42,801 who's prepared to slog away at an inner-city comprehensive. 960 00:41:42,801 --> 00:41:43,881 Make way, make way. 961 00:41:43,881 --> 00:41:46,401 This is somebody who's prepared to turn up each day 962 00:41:46,401 --> 00:41:48,081 and do that job. 963 00:41:48,081 --> 00:41:49,081 Where's the graph? 964 00:41:50,081 --> 00:41:51,601 - 60. - 60, right. 965 00:41:51,601 --> 00:41:54,081 So when the tank is full after naught hours. 966 00:41:54,081 --> 00:41:56,961 That motto water weareth away a stone 967 00:41:56,961 --> 00:41:59,601 by dripping upon it, not by smashing it 968 00:42:00,561 --> 00:42:03,721 was as a motto for teaching that you kept on teaching them, 969 00:42:03,721 --> 00:42:06,161 and that eventually it would get through, 970 00:42:06,161 --> 00:42:11,001 and the pupils would change and learn and develop and so on. 971 00:42:11,001 --> 00:42:12,921 But I think in the end, the reverse happened. 972 00:42:12,921 --> 00:42:16,681 That water dripping on me wore me away. 973 00:42:17,881 --> 00:42:22,361 I just thought, I don't think I can do this till I'm 60, 974 00:42:22,361 --> 00:42:25,521 and therefore, I'll have to do something else. 975 00:42:27,041 --> 00:42:28,161 - Do your old friends 976 00:42:28,161 --> 00:42:29,961 give you a hard time about what you've done? 977 00:42:29,961 --> 00:42:30,961 - They certainly do. 978 00:42:30,961 --> 00:42:31,841 They absolutely do. 979 00:42:31,841 --> 00:42:34,641 They say, "Oh, have we joined the Tory Party, 980 00:42:34,641 --> 00:42:37,121 "the golf club, the Masons? 981 00:42:39,401 --> 00:42:41,641 "You're driving a much better car than you used to," 982 00:42:41,641 --> 00:42:42,481 and so on. 983 00:42:43,401 --> 00:42:47,841 Well, my girlfriend is in Africa, 984 00:42:47,841 --> 00:42:50,441 And I don't think I'll have another chance 985 00:42:50,441 --> 00:42:52,321 of seeing her again. 986 00:42:52,321 --> 00:42:53,721 - Have you got any girlfriends? 987 00:42:53,721 --> 00:42:56,441 - No, no, not yet. 988 00:42:56,441 --> 00:42:59,841 I'm sure it will come but not yet. 989 00:42:59,841 --> 00:43:04,401 I mean, I do think a lot of people think too much about it. 990 00:43:04,401 --> 00:43:06,841 I think I would very much like to, 991 00:43:10,721 --> 00:43:14,081 oh, become involved in a family, my own family, for a start. 992 00:43:14,081 --> 00:43:17,601 That's a need that I feel I ought to fulfil 993 00:43:17,601 --> 00:43:20,401 and would like to fulfil and would do it well. 994 00:43:20,401 --> 00:43:22,561 Yes, I haven't got married or whatever, 995 00:43:22,561 --> 00:43:25,161 and I was supposing that that would have been something 996 00:43:25,161 --> 00:43:26,521 which I hoped had happened. 997 00:43:27,681 --> 00:43:28,521 - You're getting on a bit. 998 00:43:28,521 --> 00:43:29,761 Are you getting worried? 999 00:43:29,761 --> 00:43:30,721 - Well, not particularly. 1000 00:43:30,721 --> 00:43:32,521 I mean, I'm always optimistic. 1001 00:43:32,521 --> 00:43:34,721 I mean, who knows who I might meet tomorrow? 1002 00:43:36,041 --> 00:43:37,401 - And in the middle of a conversation 1003 00:43:37,401 --> 00:43:39,401 about something completely different, 1004 00:43:40,401 --> 00:43:45,401 he just asked if I'd like to marry him, 1005 00:43:45,521 --> 00:43:46,961 and if I hadn't been listening carefully, 1006 00:43:46,961 --> 00:43:48,321 I would have missed it completely. 1007 00:43:48,321 --> 00:43:50,001 - To love and to cherish. 1008 00:43:50,001 --> 00:43:51,441 - To love and to cherish. 1009 00:43:51,441 --> 00:43:53,561 - Till death us do part. 1010 00:43:53,561 --> 00:43:55,801 - Till death us do part. 1011 00:43:55,801 --> 00:43:57,721 - Is this a beetroot or something? 1012 00:43:57,721 --> 00:43:59,761 - I think it's just a weed. 1013 00:43:59,761 --> 00:44:01,441 - Do you enjoy gardening? 1014 00:44:02,401 --> 00:44:04,361 - Well, under Penny's directions, 1015 00:44:04,361 --> 00:44:06,281 I do whatever she asks me. 1016 00:44:06,281 --> 00:44:08,641 I don't know what to do here, 1017 00:44:08,641 --> 00:44:10,521 what order to do things in. 1018 00:44:10,521 --> 00:44:12,641 She and her mother are quite good at this. 1019 00:44:13,681 --> 00:44:15,321 - So you're the labourer? 1020 00:44:15,321 --> 00:44:19,201 - Yes, I'm the unpaid labourer, the serf, 1021 00:44:20,321 --> 00:44:23,161 the feudal vassal or whatever. 1022 00:44:23,161 --> 00:44:25,801 Well, Penny will give you the correct mediaeval terms. 1023 00:44:27,041 --> 00:44:29,481 - We don't argue very much. 1024 00:44:29,481 --> 00:44:30,281 - Not really. 1025 00:44:30,281 --> 00:44:33,241 I mean, we haven't really had a sort of full-blown row. 1026 00:44:33,241 --> 00:44:37,041 - No, our arguments sort of tend to be two sentences, 1027 00:44:37,041 --> 00:44:38,801 and I go off and sulk for 24 hours. 1028 00:44:39,881 --> 00:44:41,361 - How are you doing, dear? 1029 00:44:41,361 --> 00:44:42,201 - Fine, thank you. 1030 00:44:42,201 --> 00:44:43,801 And I think the one positive influence on him, 1031 00:44:43,801 --> 00:44:45,921 I've stopped him apologising. 1032 00:44:45,921 --> 00:44:49,401 When I first knew him, he kept saying, "Sorry, sorry," 1033 00:44:49,401 --> 00:44:50,721 and apologised for all sorts of things 1034 00:44:50,721 --> 00:44:53,601 that there was no need to apologise for. 1035 00:44:53,601 --> 00:44:55,641 Maybe it's just 'cause we weren't married then. 1036 00:44:55,641 --> 00:44:57,121 - Yeah, see, I was winning you over. 1037 00:44:57,121 --> 00:44:59,161 - Yeah, yeah, that's right. 1038 00:44:59,161 --> 00:45:01,121 - Well, you're the world's greatest cook. 1039 00:45:01,121 --> 00:45:02,281 - It's only pasta, wouldn't think it'll go far-- 1040 00:45:02,281 --> 00:45:04,161 - But if you have emotional issues, 1041 00:45:04,161 --> 00:45:05,561 will you talk about them? 1042 00:45:07,801 --> 00:45:09,721 - Well, I have the usual male reticence 1043 00:45:09,721 --> 00:45:11,241 about that kind of thing. 1044 00:45:11,241 --> 00:45:12,801 Great tea. 1045 00:45:12,801 --> 00:45:14,881 If Penny really wanted to give me a hard time, 1046 00:45:14,881 --> 00:45:17,201 she'd have to say, "Talk about your feelings." 1047 00:45:18,761 --> 00:45:19,601 That would be worse-- 1048 00:45:19,601 --> 00:45:20,441 - That would be 1049 00:45:20,441 --> 00:45:22,441 the worst thing. - Than a 24-hour sulk. 1050 00:45:22,441 --> 00:45:23,681 - Yeah. 1051 00:45:23,681 --> 00:45:24,481 - I think so, yeah. 1052 00:45:24,481 --> 00:45:25,601 I don't know whether they gonna move any of them-- 1053 00:45:25,601 --> 00:45:27,401 - We may have children, I don't know. 1054 00:45:27,401 --> 00:45:30,441 I mean, if in seven years' time or so 1055 00:45:30,441 --> 00:45:34,241 we're living in a slightly bigger house with a young family, 1056 00:45:34,241 --> 00:45:35,761 that would be nice. 1057 00:45:35,761 --> 00:45:37,921 I mean, I don't want to pin all my hopes on it 1058 00:45:37,921 --> 00:45:39,201 and nothing happens. 1059 00:45:40,281 --> 00:45:41,281 We are quite old. 1060 00:45:41,281 --> 00:45:45,281 I can seeing bringing up, say, teenage children in your 40s 1061 00:45:45,281 --> 00:45:47,361 might be a bit strange. 1062 00:45:49,241 --> 00:45:50,041 Come on, then, Henry. 1063 00:45:50,041 --> 00:45:51,121 Get on. 1064 00:45:53,201 --> 00:45:55,361 - Is it more tiring than you thought? 1065 00:45:55,361 --> 00:45:56,801 - I don't think until you're doing it 1066 00:45:56,801 --> 00:45:59,201 you realise how sleep-deprived you get 1067 00:45:59,201 --> 00:46:01,361 and how totally exhausted you are 1068 00:46:01,361 --> 00:46:03,921 all the time for several years. 1069 00:46:03,921 --> 00:46:05,841 I think that came as rather a shock. 1070 00:46:05,841 --> 00:46:08,721 - Sometimes, I go to bed at 8:30, which is ridiculous. 1071 00:46:09,721 --> 00:46:12,481 In fact, I sometimes go to bed before Henry and George. 1072 00:46:14,081 --> 00:46:15,921 - He looks like his father, doesn't he? 1073 00:46:17,961 --> 00:46:20,721 - George has got the cheekbones 1074 00:46:20,721 --> 00:46:22,121 that run in Bruce's family. 1075 00:46:23,041 --> 00:46:24,641 - And what have I got? 1076 00:46:24,641 --> 00:46:25,481 - Uh. 1077 00:46:27,921 --> 00:46:30,601 Ooh, that's hard to answer, darling. 1078 00:46:34,881 --> 00:46:36,881 - We're at my first school, 1079 00:46:36,881 --> 00:46:38,761 where I was from about five to eight, 1080 00:46:40,161 --> 00:46:43,721 and this is where I boarded for three years. 1081 00:46:45,961 --> 00:46:47,681 And I can remember being happy there. 1082 00:46:47,681 --> 00:46:51,081 I can remember also being miserable 1083 00:46:51,081 --> 00:46:53,041 because I can remember crying. 1084 00:46:53,041 --> 00:46:54,321 - Squad, steady! 1085 00:46:54,321 --> 00:46:55,841 - I always seemed to be beaten, 1086 00:46:55,841 --> 00:46:58,001 and I never used to understand why. 1087 00:46:58,001 --> 00:46:59,641 - Squad, halt! 1088 00:46:59,641 --> 00:47:01,241 - You were here because, 1089 00:47:01,241 --> 00:47:02,601 what, your parents were-- 1090 00:47:02,601 --> 00:47:07,481 - My parents were separated and were divorced. 1091 00:47:07,481 --> 00:47:12,481 And just to give me a stable place to be and be educated, 1092 00:47:12,481 --> 00:47:17,121 it was a solution to all those problems. 1093 00:47:17,121 --> 00:47:19,761 My heart's desire is to see my daddy 1094 00:47:19,761 --> 00:47:22,201 who is 6,000 miles away. 1095 00:47:23,561 --> 00:47:26,401 I did miss contact with my father 1096 00:47:26,401 --> 00:47:29,401 and, well, I say it as a joke to Penny, 1097 00:47:29,401 --> 00:47:32,281 time to send them boarding as I was. 1098 00:47:32,281 --> 00:47:33,961 And she says, "Over my dead body," 1099 00:47:33,961 --> 00:47:36,561 which is, but I wouldn't want that, either. 1100 00:47:37,601 --> 00:47:38,761 - Five years ago, 1101 00:47:38,761 --> 00:47:40,801 the family moved away from the East End 1102 00:47:40,801 --> 00:47:42,161 to be near Bruce's new school. 1103 00:47:42,161 --> 00:47:43,001 - Hey, what's in. 1104 00:47:43,001 --> 00:47:45,881 It's very quiet, its child-friendly, 1105 00:47:45,881 --> 00:47:47,441 and it just feels very safe. 1106 00:47:47,441 --> 00:47:49,521 And that's really important when you've got small children, 1107 00:47:49,521 --> 00:47:51,241 that the area feels safe. 1108 00:47:57,081 --> 00:47:59,201 - And what can you give them that you didn't have? 1109 00:47:59,201 --> 00:48:03,041 - Contact with a father that is loving, 1110 00:48:03,041 --> 00:48:05,321 and they can realise that 1111 00:48:06,481 --> 00:48:08,321 and show that love to other people 1112 00:48:09,401 --> 00:48:10,881 and realise when they're letting 1113 00:48:10,881 --> 00:48:12,321 both themselves and me down. 1114 00:48:12,321 --> 00:48:15,161 That could be a sort of guiding light for them. 1115 00:48:17,121 --> 00:48:18,721 - Do you want any more children? 1116 00:48:20,561 --> 00:48:21,401 - Well. 1117 00:48:22,881 --> 00:48:26,001 - Bruce was originally talking about a cricket team. 1118 00:48:26,001 --> 00:48:28,721 But he's got his opening batsman, 1119 00:48:28,721 --> 00:48:31,801 and that I think is gonna be his lot, frankly. 1120 00:48:31,801 --> 00:48:32,681 - I want you to play tomorrow. 1121 00:48:32,681 --> 00:48:36,081 I'm not gonna drop you from sarcasm, all right? 1122 00:48:36,081 --> 00:48:39,601 I run one of the junior teams here, the under-13s. 1123 00:48:40,681 --> 00:48:43,121 And there'll be nearly 200 boys there 1124 00:48:43,121 --> 00:48:44,641 doing that on a Saturday 1125 00:48:44,641 --> 00:48:47,041 rather than other things that could waylay them. 1126 00:48:48,441 --> 00:48:50,401 It's that combination of playing within a team 1127 00:48:50,401 --> 00:48:54,681 and the ability to back each other up and form friendships 1128 00:48:54,681 --> 00:48:56,681 that's such a nice thing. 1129 00:48:58,761 --> 00:48:59,961 - Nice shot. 1130 00:48:59,961 --> 00:49:03,241 - At weekends, Bruce plays village cricket. 1131 00:49:03,241 --> 00:49:05,481 - We don't really mind who wins and loses, 1132 00:49:05,481 --> 00:49:07,241 we obviously prefer to win 1133 00:49:07,241 --> 00:49:11,161 and we go on tour every year, so we go down to Devon. 1134 00:49:12,081 --> 00:49:13,201 Ever such a nice bunch of mates, 1135 00:49:13,201 --> 00:49:15,841 and I've known some of them for 25 years. 1136 00:49:15,841 --> 00:49:19,121 You can play at a reasonable level till you're in your 60s. 1137 00:49:20,081 --> 00:49:22,201 - And what about your batting skills? 1138 00:49:22,201 --> 00:49:23,441 - I'm mainly a bit of a slogger, 1139 00:49:23,441 --> 00:49:27,881 so I tend to bat down the order, six, seven, eight. 1140 00:49:27,881 --> 00:49:32,641 It can be brief, but the last time I played, I got 40. 1141 00:49:34,121 --> 00:49:34,961 Ooh! 1142 00:49:36,201 --> 00:49:37,041 - Great goin'! 1143 00:49:39,201 --> 00:49:41,081 - Okay, from their hiding place in the bushes, 1144 00:49:41,081 --> 00:49:41,921 William and-- 1145 00:49:41,921 --> 00:49:43,721 - Do you have fears for the future? 1146 00:49:43,721 --> 00:49:45,241 - Personally, I've kind of worried 1147 00:49:45,241 --> 00:49:47,961 that the boys will turn out all right. 1148 00:49:47,961 --> 00:49:49,441 I hope they avoid drugs. 1149 00:49:50,841 --> 00:49:54,641 To see them sleeping or carry them around is just fantastic, 1150 00:49:54,641 --> 00:49:58,961 and just the smell of them and the look of them is just, 1151 00:49:58,961 --> 00:50:00,041 you just want to protect them 1152 00:50:00,041 --> 00:50:03,321 from everything that's harmful to them. 1153 00:50:04,521 --> 00:50:06,401 - When you look back at yourself at seven, 1154 00:50:06,401 --> 00:50:08,161 can we see you now? 1155 00:50:09,841 --> 00:50:11,921 - I can't really recognise myself. 1156 00:50:11,921 --> 00:50:14,321 He looks a little bit lost and a little bit sad, 1157 00:50:14,321 --> 00:50:17,481 and I think I'm quite sort of surprised 1158 00:50:17,481 --> 00:50:21,481 to be sort of contented and reasonably happy. 1159 00:50:24,801 --> 00:50:26,561 - Do you have a dream? 1160 00:50:26,561 --> 00:50:28,041 - Well, I'd have probably liked to have played 1161 00:50:28,041 --> 00:50:31,041 international cricket but I just wasn't good enough. 1162 00:50:32,441 --> 00:50:35,041 You know, one's dreams go, and the day-to-day living 1163 00:50:35,041 --> 00:50:38,801 of ordinary life and family life takes over, 1164 00:50:41,001 --> 00:50:44,561 I think we just sort of live without our dreams. 1165 00:50:56,041 --> 00:51:00,081 - I don't like the big boys hitting us 1166 00:51:00,081 --> 00:51:04,521 and the prefects sending us out for nothing. 1167 00:51:06,961 --> 00:51:08,321 - When he was seven, 1168 00:51:08,321 --> 00:51:11,161 Paul was in care in a children's home in London. 1169 00:51:13,321 --> 00:51:16,321 Were you happy at the children's home in England? 1170 00:51:16,321 --> 00:51:17,521 - I didn't mind that, really, 1171 00:51:17,521 --> 00:51:19,681 'cause we didn't know what was going on 1172 00:51:19,681 --> 00:51:21,481 'cause we were a bit young. 1173 00:51:21,481 --> 00:51:23,961 Well, as far as I know, my mother and father, 1174 00:51:23,961 --> 00:51:26,041 well, they separated originally, I think. 1175 00:51:28,081 --> 00:51:30,161 They eventually got divorced. 1176 00:51:30,161 --> 00:51:31,241 I went to the boarding school for one year, 1177 00:51:31,241 --> 00:51:33,721 and then we emigrated to Australia. 1178 00:51:35,241 --> 00:51:37,321 - Paul settled with his father and stepmother 1179 00:51:37,321 --> 00:51:39,041 in a suburb of Melbourne. 1180 00:51:40,201 --> 00:51:41,881 What mark has it left on you 1181 00:51:41,881 --> 00:51:44,321 the fact that you were brought up within a bad marriage? 1182 00:51:44,321 --> 00:51:46,281 - The only thing I can say 1183 00:51:46,281 --> 00:51:48,321 that I think might have come from that 1184 00:51:48,321 --> 00:51:50,801 is just my lack of confidence 1185 00:51:50,801 --> 00:51:54,681 and being able to show my feelings, really, I suppose. 1186 00:51:54,681 --> 00:51:56,961 - Would you like to get married, Paul? 1187 00:51:56,961 --> 00:51:58,241 - No. 1188 00:51:58,241 --> 00:51:59,561 - Tell me why not. 1189 00:51:59,561 --> 00:52:01,001 - I don't like... 1190 00:52:02,481 --> 00:52:05,281 Say you had a wife. 1191 00:52:05,281 --> 00:52:09,601 They say you had to eat what they cooked you, 1192 00:52:09,601 --> 00:52:13,041 and say I don't like greens. 1193 00:52:13,041 --> 00:52:13,881 Well, I don't. 1194 00:52:14,881 --> 00:52:18,041 Oh, no, I prefer to be alone, really. 1195 00:52:18,041 --> 00:52:21,641 I can't say I don't wanna get married, 'cause I think I do, 1196 00:52:21,641 --> 00:52:23,001 but I wanna be happily married 1197 00:52:23,001 --> 00:52:25,681 and therefore, I wanna make sure, I think. 1198 00:52:25,681 --> 00:52:27,321 - What is it that you fell in love with? 1199 00:52:27,321 --> 00:52:28,641 What is it about him? 1200 00:52:28,641 --> 00:52:30,681 - His helplessness, I suppose. 1201 00:52:30,681 --> 00:52:32,841 It was the motherly instinct in me 1202 00:52:32,841 --> 00:52:34,161 to pick him up and cuddle him. 1203 00:52:34,161 --> 00:52:36,361 And he's also very good looking, I think, 1204 00:52:36,361 --> 00:52:39,001 but he doesn't agree with me. 1205 00:52:39,001 --> 00:52:41,801 In the summer he's got this cute little bum in shorts. 1206 00:52:42,921 --> 00:52:44,641 I mean, I can tell quite a few stories here, 1207 00:52:44,641 --> 00:52:46,961 but the one that really irritates me the most 1208 00:52:46,961 --> 00:52:49,961 is when we have an argument he says, "That's it, leave me." 1209 00:52:49,961 --> 00:52:51,761 And I say, "Fine, all right, I will one day." 1210 00:52:51,761 --> 00:52:55,961 We had our 20th wedding anniversary just before Christmas. 1211 00:52:55,961 --> 00:52:56,961 - Which is the life sentence. 1212 00:52:56,961 --> 00:52:58,561 - Yeah, everyone reckons 1213 00:52:58,561 --> 00:53:00,521 that we should be out of jail by now. 1214 00:53:00,521 --> 00:53:02,281 - To a certain extent we started thinking, 1215 00:53:02,281 --> 00:53:04,961 well, do we really know each other now? 1216 00:53:04,961 --> 00:53:08,881 Because you just get in the humdrum of going to work, 1217 00:53:08,881 --> 00:53:10,481 coming back home-- 1218 00:53:10,481 --> 00:53:11,481 - Running kids here and-- 1219 00:53:11,481 --> 00:53:12,641 - Kids here and there. 1220 00:53:12,641 --> 00:53:13,441 I don't think you mean to 1221 00:53:13,441 --> 00:53:16,881 but you probably stop thinking about each other a lot. 1222 00:53:16,881 --> 00:53:19,961 I find it hard to express emotion most of the time, 1223 00:53:19,961 --> 00:53:23,601 although I'm getting on top of that more now. 1224 00:53:24,881 --> 00:53:26,721 Just the simple things, to say to, sort of, 1225 00:53:26,721 --> 00:53:29,561 Susan, I love you, something like that. 1226 00:53:29,561 --> 00:53:30,881 I can tell you about it, 1227 00:53:30,881 --> 00:53:35,881 but I really haven't been able to say it freely to Sue. 1228 00:53:37,321 --> 00:53:38,441 It's a bit hard to talk about. 1229 00:53:38,441 --> 00:53:40,481 I did end up having to get a bit of help, 1230 00:53:40,481 --> 00:53:42,761 and it wasn't directly due to our relationship. 1231 00:53:42,761 --> 00:53:44,841 It started at work, unfortunately, 1232 00:53:44,841 --> 00:53:47,561 which brought my self-esteem down 1233 00:53:47,561 --> 00:53:49,841 which tended to affect everything else. 1234 00:53:50,801 --> 00:53:52,881 And I was just very fortunate 1235 00:53:52,881 --> 00:53:56,481 that I saw a local doctor and with her help, 1236 00:53:56,481 --> 00:53:59,001 I started coming back to normal thinking, probably. 1237 00:54:00,321 --> 00:54:04,801 I mean, I was feeling a little bit worried 1238 00:54:04,801 --> 00:54:05,641 about the relationship 1239 00:54:05,641 --> 00:54:07,401 because I felt like I hadn't progressed. 1240 00:54:07,401 --> 00:54:08,441 I was going backwards. 1241 00:54:08,441 --> 00:54:11,081 And, I mean, I still believe that. 1242 00:54:11,081 --> 00:54:14,641 I was thinking that why would Susan 1243 00:54:14,641 --> 00:54:15,881 wanna be with someone as, 1244 00:54:17,001 --> 00:54:18,881 sounds funny but as boring as me, 1245 00:54:18,881 --> 00:54:20,401 'cause there was nothing there. 1246 00:54:20,401 --> 00:54:21,881 I mean, what do I do? 1247 00:54:21,881 --> 00:54:25,481 - How do I say it? 1248 00:54:25,481 --> 00:54:27,441 It was a shock that he got that low 1249 00:54:27,441 --> 00:54:28,801 and that he doubted the relationship 1250 00:54:28,801 --> 00:54:30,281 because one thing I've always known 1251 00:54:30,281 --> 00:54:32,921 is that Paul's never doubted his love for me. 1252 00:54:32,921 --> 00:54:34,321 You know, it's always been there, 1253 00:54:34,321 --> 00:54:36,041 and I've never doubted it, either. 1254 00:54:37,121 --> 00:54:39,841 - Did the physical side of your marriage suffer? 1255 00:54:39,841 --> 00:54:40,681 - I think it did. 1256 00:54:42,441 --> 00:54:43,841 I think it did, really. 1257 00:54:43,841 --> 00:54:44,881 - For a little while. 1258 00:54:47,001 --> 00:54:50,081 We promised ourselves when we first got married 1259 00:54:50,081 --> 00:54:53,001 that we'd never stop touching 1260 00:54:53,001 --> 00:54:55,041 or being affectionate towards each other. 1261 00:54:55,041 --> 00:54:57,321 And in front of the children, we've always been, 1262 00:54:57,321 --> 00:54:59,281 and even now with the children, 1263 00:54:59,281 --> 00:55:04,281 we still embrace a lot, both Katy and Robert. 1264 00:55:04,281 --> 00:55:05,121 I mean--- 1265 00:55:05,121 --> 00:55:08,401 - Katy will sometimes say, "Mother, stop it." 1266 00:55:09,961 --> 00:55:11,201 I was gonna be a policeman 1267 00:55:11,201 --> 00:55:15,761 but I thought how hard it would be to join in. 1268 00:55:15,761 --> 00:55:17,561 I just haven't made up my mind yet. 1269 00:55:17,561 --> 00:55:19,121 I was gonna be a phys ed teacher 1270 00:55:19,121 --> 00:55:21,561 but one of the teachers told me 1271 00:55:21,561 --> 00:55:24,681 that you had to get up into university. 1272 00:55:27,161 --> 00:55:29,801 - At 21, Paul was a junior partner 1273 00:55:29,801 --> 00:55:31,281 in a firm of bricklayers. 1274 00:55:32,841 --> 00:55:36,281 By 28, he'd gone out on his own as a subcontractor. 1275 00:55:37,401 --> 00:55:40,801 - I think when I started work for myself, 1276 00:55:40,801 --> 00:55:42,881 things were looking good for me 1277 00:55:42,881 --> 00:55:44,801 'cause I was out of school, 1278 00:55:44,801 --> 00:55:47,201 something I was very enthusiastic about. 1279 00:55:48,241 --> 00:55:50,681 And I was chasing the dangling carrot 1280 00:55:50,681 --> 00:55:53,601 but never got there 'cause, I mean, really, 1281 00:55:53,601 --> 00:55:57,601 I'm a worker and not a businessman. 1282 00:55:58,961 --> 00:56:00,841 - By the time he was 42, 1283 00:56:00,841 --> 00:56:02,801 Paul was doing factory work, 1284 00:56:02,801 --> 00:56:04,921 making signs for a plastics company. 1285 00:56:06,321 --> 00:56:08,921 What's the future for you at work, do you think? 1286 00:56:08,921 --> 00:56:10,681 - Well, I mean, the job's still there. 1287 00:56:10,681 --> 00:56:11,921 I've had talks with them 1288 00:56:11,921 --> 00:56:15,161 about whether they were ushering me out the door, 1289 00:56:15,161 --> 00:56:16,801 and they say they're not. 1290 00:56:16,801 --> 00:56:18,521 Not that I'm that old, but it's a bit of worry 1291 00:56:18,521 --> 00:56:21,641 about getting a full-time job with my skill levels. 1292 00:56:25,001 --> 00:56:26,441 - Sue had been a hairdresser 1293 00:56:26,441 --> 00:56:29,681 for most of her working life, but at 49, 1294 00:56:29,681 --> 00:56:31,401 she has a new career 1295 00:56:31,401 --> 00:56:34,521 as an occupational therapist in a retirement home. 1296 00:56:36,801 --> 00:56:38,441 - You might be in your 40's and getting older, 1297 00:56:38,441 --> 00:56:40,001 but you still have a lot to add 1298 00:56:40,001 --> 00:56:42,801 and you can learn to go in a different direction. 1299 00:56:42,801 --> 00:56:44,241 I call this my sea change. 1300 00:56:45,961 --> 00:56:47,561 - Do you have ambitions? 1301 00:56:47,561 --> 00:56:48,401 - Not really now. 1302 00:56:49,481 --> 00:56:51,361 I've been in this job 10 years 1303 00:56:51,361 --> 00:56:53,081 and never asked for a pay rise. 1304 00:56:53,081 --> 00:56:55,041 That's just what I've always been like. 1305 00:56:56,641 --> 00:56:59,041 - Has it affected home life at all? 1306 00:56:59,041 --> 00:57:00,641 - It has affected a little bit 1307 00:57:00,641 --> 00:57:03,601 because I'm not there at home as much as I used to be 1308 00:57:03,601 --> 00:57:04,881 for when Paul got home. 1309 00:57:05,881 --> 00:57:06,801 - It can be, 1310 00:57:08,321 --> 00:57:09,561 and I'm sure I'm not the only one, 1311 00:57:09,561 --> 00:57:11,921 it can be quite startling. 1312 00:57:11,921 --> 00:57:14,641 You get home and you think, there's no one here. 1313 00:57:14,641 --> 00:57:17,081 - When I've been here for 30 years to be home to. 1314 00:57:17,081 --> 00:57:18,801 - It's really different. 1315 00:57:18,801 --> 00:57:20,081 - Oh, good fist away by-- 1316 00:57:20,081 --> 00:57:21,881 - By the time they were 28, 1317 00:57:21,881 --> 00:57:25,601 Paul and Sue had two children, Katy and Robert. 1318 00:57:26,561 --> 00:57:28,561 - Picked up. 1319 00:57:29,961 --> 00:57:31,801 - Katy did well at school 1320 00:57:31,801 --> 00:57:35,041 and got a place at university to study archaeology. 1321 00:57:36,601 --> 00:57:39,801 - They're photos of the dig in Cyprus that I went on 1322 00:57:39,801 --> 00:57:42,401 and we were digging in bronze age tombs 1323 00:57:42,401 --> 00:57:44,721 that are around the village. 1324 00:57:44,721 --> 00:57:46,441 - You're the first person 1325 00:57:46,441 --> 00:57:47,641 in the family to go to university. 1326 00:57:47,641 --> 00:57:49,761 Was it a struggle for you? 1327 00:57:49,761 --> 00:57:53,801 - It was a bit because I had to do it all by myself. 1328 00:57:53,801 --> 00:57:55,721 I had nobody to really help me 1329 00:57:55,721 --> 00:57:57,361 'cause mum and dad couldn't help me 1330 00:57:57,361 --> 00:57:59,881 with my essays or things like that. 1331 00:57:59,881 --> 00:58:02,481 - What does university mean? 1332 00:58:02,481 --> 00:58:03,881 I'm pretty happy with Katy 1333 00:58:03,881 --> 00:58:05,321 and I'm not having a go at Rob, 1334 00:58:05,321 --> 00:58:07,681 but I've got views for Robert, 1335 00:58:07,681 --> 00:58:09,481 'cause he's struggling a little bit. 1336 00:58:10,721 --> 00:58:13,161 - Robert has trained as a car mechanic. 1337 00:58:14,401 --> 00:58:16,681 - He's got reading and writing difficulties 1338 00:58:16,681 --> 00:58:18,241 and, I mean, he's coping with that. 1339 00:58:18,241 --> 00:58:21,201 We'd like to see him be a little bit more proactive 1340 00:58:21,201 --> 00:58:23,841 at doing literacy course now he's a bit older. 1341 00:58:25,041 --> 00:58:29,001 But just day-to-day troubles of making ends meet with money, 1342 00:58:29,001 --> 00:58:30,641 that's always hard. 1343 00:58:30,641 --> 00:58:32,721 - He went nuts at me for using the phone, 1344 00:58:32,721 --> 00:58:33,601 "No more fucking back, 1345 00:58:33,601 --> 00:58:36,801 "you constantly fuckin' do this all the time." 1346 00:58:36,801 --> 00:58:39,521 - What's Robert got that you gave him? 1347 00:58:39,521 --> 00:58:40,881 - Moodiness. 1348 00:58:40,881 --> 00:58:42,761 I think Robert's even a little bit more moody 1349 00:58:42,761 --> 00:58:44,441 than what I've ever been. 1350 00:58:45,321 --> 00:58:48,001 He's not your average relaxed 21-year-old. 1351 00:58:50,961 --> 00:58:52,801 - Whatcha doin'? 1352 00:58:52,801 --> 00:58:55,521 We only had two children, because we thought 1353 00:58:55,521 --> 00:58:57,281 that we couldn't love any more children 1354 00:58:57,281 --> 00:58:58,481 as much as we loved our two. 1355 00:58:58,481 --> 00:59:01,201 And now we've got our two grandchildren, we just love them. 1356 00:59:01,201 --> 00:59:02,121 - We love them as much, really. 1357 00:59:02,121 --> 00:59:03,921 - As much, yeah. 1358 00:59:03,921 --> 00:59:05,721 Yay! 1359 00:59:05,721 --> 00:59:06,721 - With Rob and Stacey, 1360 00:59:06,721 --> 00:59:09,521 we don't really know how long they're gonna last for 1361 00:59:09,521 --> 00:59:12,641 and I keep my fingers crossed they will last. 1362 00:59:13,721 --> 00:59:18,001 We can only hope that they work at it like we do. 1363 00:59:18,001 --> 00:59:20,561 - That's better, thank you. 1364 00:59:21,401 --> 00:59:22,241 - In their 20s, 1365 00:59:22,241 --> 00:59:25,401 Paul and Sue sold up, bought an old van 1366 00:59:25,401 --> 00:59:27,801 and travelled across Australia. 1367 00:59:27,801 --> 00:59:29,521 - I think it brought us closer together, 1368 00:59:29,521 --> 00:59:30,961 because we really got to know each other 1369 00:59:30,961 --> 00:59:33,001 and relied on each other so much. 1370 00:59:36,481 --> 00:59:37,961 - One of the most important things 1371 00:59:37,961 --> 00:59:40,401 we ever did with our children was spend time with them. 1372 00:59:40,401 --> 00:59:43,441 And particularly, when you've got holidays, 1373 00:59:43,441 --> 00:59:45,321 to actually, which a lot of parents do, 1374 00:59:45,321 --> 00:59:47,281 go camping with them. 1375 00:59:50,201 --> 00:59:51,441 - We've been camping there now, 1376 00:59:51,441 --> 00:59:53,401 we've actually went to that for 19 years, 1377 00:59:53,401 --> 00:59:55,721 'cause Robert was two when we first went there. 1378 00:59:56,601 --> 00:59:58,161 - So does this beat the old van? 1379 00:59:58,161 --> 01:00:00,121 - This is the Hilton compared to that old van. 1380 01:00:00,121 --> 01:00:01,441 - So you've got any plans 1381 01:00:01,441 --> 01:00:04,001 for any big trips now the children have gone? 1382 01:00:04,001 --> 01:00:05,681 - I think we'd like to do something again 1383 01:00:05,681 --> 01:00:08,401 but you need to have the finances 1384 01:00:08,401 --> 01:00:10,961 to support yourself for a few months. 1385 01:00:10,961 --> 01:00:14,761 - The monitors opened the washroom, sendin' us out, 1386 01:00:14,761 --> 01:00:18,401 well, there's no talking, and I wasn't talking today. 1387 01:00:20,201 --> 01:00:24,001 I'm more at peace around the horses and the animals. 1388 01:00:25,481 --> 01:00:28,321 I can be upset, I can be on edge, come down to the horses, 1389 01:00:28,321 --> 01:00:30,321 within three or four minutes of being here, 1390 01:00:30,321 --> 01:00:32,721 and I've forgotten everything, 1391 01:00:32,721 --> 01:00:34,121 so it does calm you down. 1392 01:00:36,641 --> 01:00:38,401 - So last time I came, you had the horses. 1393 01:00:38,401 --> 01:00:40,041 What's happened to the horses? 1394 01:00:41,121 --> 01:00:44,521 - Well, we gave Poykin away to some people 1395 01:00:44,521 --> 01:00:47,641 because it was a little bit expensive 1396 01:00:47,641 --> 01:00:49,921 and also the fun went out of it, basically. 1397 01:00:51,041 --> 01:00:52,721 - How do you get that peace now? 1398 01:00:52,721 --> 01:00:55,281 - Well, I think I got it through running. 1399 01:00:58,681 --> 01:01:01,441 - Well, most Sunday mornings, we go training. 1400 01:01:01,441 --> 01:01:03,161 When Paul is doing marathons, 1401 01:01:04,121 --> 01:01:06,081 when he's gotta run great distances, 1402 01:01:06,081 --> 01:01:08,481 I follow along with the bike as a bit of support 1403 01:01:08,481 --> 01:01:12,001 and I take drinks for him so he doesn't get dehydrated. 1404 01:01:13,321 --> 01:01:16,361 Something we can do together, so we do that. 1405 01:01:16,361 --> 01:01:19,041 We're not doing any great distances, we're just, 1406 01:01:19,041 --> 01:01:20,361 I've got an injured knee. 1407 01:01:20,361 --> 01:01:23,321 Just trying to build it up so it gets used to running again. 1408 01:01:24,161 --> 01:01:26,241 I did the host city marathon, 1409 01:01:26,241 --> 01:01:29,281 was my first marathon I did up in Sydney. 1410 01:01:29,281 --> 01:01:32,961 And I trialled the Olympic course, and it was open to anyone. 1411 01:01:32,961 --> 01:01:36,241 So I figured if you were gonna do a marathon, 1412 01:01:36,241 --> 01:01:39,481 that'd be the one to do. 1413 01:01:39,481 --> 01:01:43,041 Nearly died, but I enjoyed it. 1414 01:01:43,041 --> 01:01:44,601 My idea of happiness to me 1415 01:01:44,601 --> 01:01:48,401 is a love for life and a love for people. 1416 01:01:49,281 --> 01:01:50,401 - When you look back on the marriage 1417 01:01:50,401 --> 01:01:52,841 and the family, any regrets? 1418 01:01:52,841 --> 01:01:55,481 - No, we wish we'd had more children, but then who knows? 1419 01:01:55,481 --> 01:01:57,961 If we'd had them, might have gone, no, too many. 1420 01:01:57,961 --> 01:02:01,081 - We might be both in the nuthouse. 1421 01:02:02,801 --> 01:02:04,841 - But without a family, what have you got? 1422 01:02:04,841 --> 01:02:06,441 Nothing. 1423 01:02:06,441 --> 01:02:08,881 Well, that's the way I feel. 1424 01:02:08,881 --> 01:02:10,601 - More than work, more than achieving? 1425 01:02:10,601 --> 01:02:13,401 - Yeah, like, what you've got, 1426 01:02:13,401 --> 01:02:14,921 you've got nothing unless you've got family 1427 01:02:14,921 --> 01:02:16,081 and your health anyway. 1428 01:02:17,521 --> 01:02:20,401 You'd be awfully lonely without family, I think. 1429 01:02:22,961 --> 01:02:25,281 - Tell me, do you have any boyfriends, Suzy? 1430 01:02:27,321 --> 01:02:28,921 - Yes. 1431 01:02:28,921 --> 01:02:30,761 - Tell me about him. 1432 01:02:30,761 --> 01:02:33,881 - He lives up in Scotland, and I think he's 13. 1433 01:02:36,881 --> 01:02:38,761 - Have you got any boyfriends, Susan? 1434 01:02:42,041 --> 01:02:46,801 What is your attitude towards marriage for yourself? 1435 01:02:50,841 --> 01:02:51,761 - Well, I don't know. 1436 01:02:51,761 --> 01:02:52,681 I mean, I haven't given it a lot of thought, 1437 01:02:52,681 --> 01:02:54,601 'cause I am very, very cynical about it. 1438 01:02:58,281 --> 01:03:00,681 But then you get a certain amount of faith restored in it. 1439 01:03:00,681 --> 01:03:02,161 I mean, I've got friends, 1440 01:03:02,161 --> 01:03:04,801 and their parents are happily married, 1441 01:03:04,801 --> 01:03:06,761 and so it does put faith back into you 1442 01:03:06,761 --> 01:03:09,921 but me myself, I'm very cynical about it. 1443 01:03:09,921 --> 01:03:12,601 - When I last saw you at 21, you were nervous, 1444 01:03:12,601 --> 01:03:14,721 you were chain-smoking, you were uptight, 1445 01:03:14,721 --> 01:03:17,401 and now you seem happy. 1446 01:03:17,401 --> 01:03:20,241 What's happened to you over these last seven years? 1447 01:03:21,721 --> 01:03:22,681 - I suppose Rupert. 1448 01:03:23,961 --> 01:03:25,281 I'll give you some credit. 1449 01:03:26,681 --> 01:03:29,801 - I'm now chain-smoking. 1450 01:03:32,041 --> 01:03:34,921 - No, I think you can't just walk through a marriage 1451 01:03:34,921 --> 01:03:36,241 and think it's once you get married, 1452 01:03:36,241 --> 01:03:39,401 it's all gonna be roses and everything forever. 1453 01:03:40,401 --> 01:03:41,761 You know, you have... 1454 01:03:43,921 --> 01:03:47,081 Everybody has their rows but we've never yet had a row 1455 01:03:47,081 --> 01:03:49,161 that we haven't managed to sort out. 1456 01:03:50,201 --> 01:03:52,401 It's very hard to actually say what it is 1457 01:03:52,401 --> 01:03:54,601 that goes on between a couple, 1458 01:03:54,601 --> 01:03:57,001 it's either there or it's not. 1459 01:03:58,721 --> 01:04:01,201 We've been married 27 years now. 1460 01:04:02,041 --> 01:04:05,361 Any marriage has its ups and downs, 1461 01:04:05,361 --> 01:04:09,681 but somehow, whether it's through luck or determination, 1462 01:04:09,681 --> 01:04:13,241 we've worked through the difficult times. 1463 01:04:15,961 --> 01:04:18,401 He's just always been there for me, 1464 01:04:18,401 --> 01:04:22,881 and I know I can rely on him. 1465 01:04:22,881 --> 01:04:25,561 And he's my punch bag 1466 01:04:25,561 --> 01:04:29,721 in the same way as I'm probably his, but it works. 1467 01:04:29,721 --> 01:04:32,561 When I get married, I'd like to have two children. 1468 01:04:32,561 --> 01:04:35,641 I'm not very children-minded at the moment. 1469 01:04:35,641 --> 01:04:37,161 I don't know if I ever will be. 1470 01:04:39,521 --> 01:04:40,881 - What do you think about them? 1471 01:04:40,881 --> 01:04:43,041 - Oh, I don't like babies. 1472 01:04:45,081 --> 01:04:49,241 - At 28, Suzy had two sons, Thomas and Oliver. 1473 01:04:50,721 --> 01:04:54,441 By the time she was 34, Suzy had a daughter, Laura. 1474 01:04:55,761 --> 01:04:56,641 - Mummy? 1475 01:04:56,641 --> 01:04:57,481 - Yeah? 1476 01:04:57,481 --> 01:04:58,321 - I don't want to. 1477 01:04:58,321 --> 01:05:00,041 - So what are the children up to? 1478 01:05:03,001 --> 01:05:05,841 - Tom is living in London, having graduated, 1479 01:05:05,841 --> 01:05:08,481 and now working and living in London. 1480 01:05:08,481 --> 01:05:10,881 Ollie is working and living at home 1481 01:05:12,041 --> 01:05:14,441 and Laura is doing her AS levels. 1482 01:05:16,201 --> 01:05:20,201 It was difficult when they first started to move away. 1483 01:05:20,201 --> 01:05:23,281 All those memories of the children growing up. 1484 01:05:23,281 --> 01:05:24,961 It's like a closed chapter now, 1485 01:05:24,961 --> 01:05:27,921 'cause you can't bring those days back. 1486 01:05:31,041 --> 01:05:32,801 I think what I admire about the young today 1487 01:05:32,801 --> 01:05:37,561 is their confidence, and that's what I wished I'd had. 1488 01:05:37,561 --> 01:05:42,481 They just seem to take life and deal with it. 1489 01:05:45,641 --> 01:05:47,521 - What sort of things do you do? 1490 01:05:47,521 --> 01:05:50,801 - Ride, swim, play tennis, ping-pong. 1491 01:05:53,361 --> 01:05:57,081 And I might play croquet, anything like that. 1492 01:05:59,481 --> 01:06:01,361 - I did have a privileged childhood, 1493 01:06:02,641 --> 01:06:05,881 but you have to take responsibility for your life 1494 01:06:05,881 --> 01:06:07,961 somewhere along the line, 1495 01:06:07,961 --> 01:06:11,441 and some people take responsibility earlier than others. 1496 01:06:11,441 --> 01:06:13,361 I was just a bit later taking it. 1497 01:06:15,881 --> 01:06:19,401 Maybe now is the first time 1498 01:06:19,401 --> 01:06:23,641 that I actually feel happy within my own skin. 1499 01:06:23,641 --> 01:06:27,161 It's taken me a long time to do it, 1500 01:06:28,121 --> 01:06:29,561 but I actually feel 1501 01:06:30,641 --> 01:06:32,401 that I can accept decisions, 1502 01:06:32,401 --> 01:06:35,841 wrong decisions, possibly, that I've made in the past, 1503 01:06:35,841 --> 01:06:37,161 I am comfortable with it now. 1504 01:06:37,161 --> 01:06:38,161 I can live with it. 1505 01:06:40,161 --> 01:06:41,881 - So what's it been like for you 1506 01:06:41,881 --> 01:06:43,121 being in these films? 1507 01:06:45,921 --> 01:06:48,041 - Very difficult, very painful. 1508 01:06:50,561 --> 01:06:53,121 Not an experience I've enjoyed in any way. 1509 01:06:54,161 --> 01:06:56,401 Every seven years, it throws up issues 1510 01:06:56,401 --> 01:07:01,401 that I guess we all learn to put into compartments 1511 01:07:01,561 --> 01:07:02,561 between the seven years, 1512 01:07:02,561 --> 01:07:05,921 and then it all gets opened up again, and it's difficult. 1513 01:07:09,161 --> 01:07:10,441 We were all landed in it, 1514 01:07:10,441 --> 01:07:13,481 and most of us have, whatever reason, 1515 01:07:13,481 --> 01:07:15,041 chosen to go through with it. 1516 01:07:17,721 --> 01:07:20,041 I'm not an outgoing, confident person. 1517 01:07:21,841 --> 01:07:23,041 I like my privacy. 1518 01:07:23,041 --> 01:07:28,001 I don't like however many million people 1519 01:07:28,001 --> 01:07:29,921 picking over my life. 1520 01:07:32,401 --> 01:07:34,041 - And is that what they do, do you think? 1521 01:07:35,961 --> 01:07:37,721 - I should think for a couple of minutes, yes, 1522 01:07:37,721 --> 01:07:39,641 and then it's yesterday's news. 1523 01:07:42,481 --> 01:07:47,481 And people seem to read into what they think we all think, 1524 01:07:47,481 --> 01:07:50,561 which I find very hurtful, really, 1525 01:07:50,561 --> 01:07:53,321 'cause most of them come up with things that they think, 1526 01:07:53,321 --> 01:07:55,881 which is nothing like what's going through my head. 1527 01:07:56,721 --> 01:07:59,241 Oh, so she might be all right. 1528 01:08:00,081 --> 01:08:03,561 What's the point of people sort of going into people's lives 1529 01:08:03,561 --> 01:08:05,001 and saying, "Why do you like this?" and, "Why don't you?" 1530 01:08:05,001 --> 01:08:06,601 I just don't see any point in it. 1531 01:08:06,601 --> 01:08:09,721 - So have you had enough of being in the film? 1532 01:08:09,721 --> 01:08:11,401 - I mean, who knows in seven years 1533 01:08:11,401 --> 01:08:16,401 whether it'll be done again but this is me 1534 01:08:17,321 --> 01:08:21,721 saying hopefully, I'll reach my half-century next year, 1535 01:08:21,721 --> 01:08:24,281 and I shall bow out. 1536 01:08:28,761 --> 01:08:30,601 - And what about the other children, 1537 01:08:30,601 --> 01:08:33,041 where are they now, what are they doing? 1538 01:08:33,921 --> 01:08:38,081 - If I can change the world I'd change into a diamond. 1539 01:08:38,081 --> 01:08:39,601 I don't really think that I've done anything 1540 01:08:39,601 --> 01:08:41,561 you can call a great success. 1541 01:08:41,561 --> 01:08:44,841 - When I was born, an illegitimate child, 1542 01:08:44,841 --> 01:08:48,681 that something's only whispered about. 1543 01:08:49,521 --> 01:08:51,601 - I'm going to work in Woolworths. 1544 01:08:51,601 --> 01:08:55,161 At times you think Christ what have I done? 1545 01:08:55,161 --> 01:08:58,201 - I read the "Financial times". 1546 01:08:58,201 --> 01:09:00,441 - I read "The Observer" and "The Times". 1547 01:09:00,441 --> 01:09:03,521 It's very irresponsible because we all want more money, 1548 01:09:03,521 --> 01:09:05,641 as much money as we can get. 1549 01:09:05,641 --> 01:09:07,921 - When I grow up I want to be an astronaut 1550 01:09:07,921 --> 01:09:09,721 but if I can't be an astronaut, 1551 01:09:09,721 --> 01:09:12,601 I think I'll be a coach driver. 1552 01:09:12,601 --> 01:09:14,961 I tend to think most likely answer 1553 01:09:14,961 --> 01:09:16,481 is that I'll be wandering homeless 1554 01:09:16,481 --> 01:09:18,561 round the streets of London 1555 01:09:18,561 --> 01:09:21,441 but with a bit of luck, that won't happen. 1556 01:09:22,561 --> 01:09:25,721 - Is Neil still wandering alone through Britain? 1557 01:09:25,721 --> 01:09:27,161 Find out next week.